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Dabbling...any CNC assisted guys here?

Discussion in 'Instrument Makers' started by FLQuacker, Jul 31, 2018.

  1. FLQuacker

    FLQuacker Member Full Member Thread Starter

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    Got a couple......hundred questions :)

    Solid body tele style.

    Got some great insight from Arn213....thought I'd move the discussion to it's appropriate place.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
  2. CWS

    CWS Member Full Member

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    I will try to answer some of your questions. I have used a cnc four 4 years. I have done a lot of things but I can't remember most of them. What software are you using?
     
  3. FLQuacker

    FLQuacker Member Full Member Thread Starter

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    Thanks Curt....my questions are more luthier oriented than CNC

    I've decided to cut a solid body with mine, and was hoping to find some cut files but came up empty

    So what I found was a pdf drawing that seems to be rather popular by a fellow named Terry Downs, who made it publicly available.

    I converted it to dxf, so I could play with it and create my own cut files in Vcarve.

    This first build was just going to be a body cut/shape with "store bought" components.

    It seems from what I've researched, the dimensions listed and how I've created the cut files from the schematic, they jive with the specs of a standard tele neck at the pocket and the bridge drills (for example)

    Thats the kinda stuff I had questions about.

    I know there is some gorgeous stuff documented here that Im sure are umpteen hrs involved.....hopefully my path isnt considered sacrilegious :)

    tele.PNG

    3dtele.PNG
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2018
  4. rocky1

    rocky1 Creator of Shavings and Sawdust! Full Member

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  5. rocky1

    rocky1 Creator of Shavings and Sawdust! Full Member

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  6. Arn213

    Arn213 craM de la craM # RipJack City! Full Member

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    That tele plan is based on a 1952. There is a “hump” between the heel and the scoop of the horn and there is that angled wire route between the neck and bridge pickup cavity route. There are details you need to think about as it will affect that beautiful figured cherry that you have- you would probably want to “showcase” as much of the figuring and grain, uninterrupted without any component interference or break the pattern/figuring/grain flow of your cherry. Typically, there is a plastic pickguard that the neck pickup is mounted on- that “angled route” is there to serve for “wireway”. You don’t need that unless you are doing a period correct 1952 build. You can simply drill out a hole for the wireway towards the main control cavity route (location of the 3-way, volume and tone). Point is do you want a good amount of “plastic real estate” to cover that much figuring and break up it’s flow? You can mount that neck pickup directly into the body (you can use a pickup ring surround to conceal the route or not)- you then do not need the “angled route”.

    The other thing you want to consider is if you want the metal flange plate to exist that conceals the 3 way selector/volume/knob pots, etc. in the front. That is a fair amount of shiny metal that could break the flow of the figured cherry surface as it would be upfront. If it was me, I would reverse the front cover plate and do the control route in the back instead (the back plate would be flat without any shaft holes or 3 way selector holes)- this way only the shaft of the volume and control knob as well as the 3 way selector will be exposed (you would have to drill out locations at the front). Ideally, I would slice off a thicker veneer piece from the 2” thick cherry and use that as backplate for the back- since it is thin, I would use the non book-match face portion of it and the grain and figure should line up, so that it appears continuous and seamless. In any case, you can do whatever to suit your style and taste.........

    See photo below (not mine and for reference only):

    2E5192DF-E9DF-4021-8181-FEC159BE183B.jpeg
     
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    Last edited: Aug 2, 2018
  7. FLQuacker

    FLQuacker Member Full Member Thread Starter

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    Ah yeah...gives it the LP look, that I like!

    I wasn't forward thinkn past just getting a cut file created.

    Point taken, and probably the first deviation. Now that I have a profile built I can do pretty much anything. It will just require a "flip", which is what I wanted to avoid for simplicity, but it's not that difficult.

    Awesome pineycaster....I just happen to know a guy with a 400 year old slab or 2. He's already been approached by a local luthier!

    Thanks!
     
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    Last edited: Aug 2, 2018
  8. Arn213

    Arn213 craM de la craM # RipJack City! Full Member

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    I was just relaying some options and food for thought. Once you program to cut and route, there is no going back. There are many options for the bridge- there is vintage (lip surround with 3 vintage saddles) and modern (one shown is modern with 6 adjustable saddles with the lip surround). There are some variation of it as well where the bridge top plate is cut off where the 3 point screws are. There are also a top mount bridge where there are no ferrules at the back of the guitar. There are also standard fixed bridge. Having said that, there is a debate that the signature sound of the tele bridge pickups comes from the one piece plate and mounted as such (3 point). This debate also resides about the neck pick up being mounted into the plastic guard versus mounting the neck pickup directly into the wood. Bringing that up just because it could affect the outcome of the sound for your build. Anyway, lot’s of details to think off OR you could just build away and see what the end results are.

    The control knobs if the chrome or nickel is too much for you (weight and sheen), there are aftermarket parts where you can get wood knobs, etc.

    ^^^^^BTW, that is a flame redwood top double bound with a mahogany core^^^^^.

    400 old pine sounds like dried, seasoned and crystallized wood. If it is heartwood pine, refer back to the body blank target weight I mentioned on the other thread you had. Heartwood pine as you know is harder, denser and heavier compare to standard pine- south of 2 pounds per board foot to about 3 pounds per board foot.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 2, 2018
  9. Blueglass

    Blueglass Member Full Member

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    I know nothing about CNC unfortunately. For my first I bought router templates which I'm using again on my second. For my 3rd I am going to make my own templates for a semi hollow of my own shape..

    Arn is right you want to tink about averything you want to play aestheically and acoustically. The pockets for Fender are usually pretty standard but do the research on the exact neck you want to get. Better yet order it and get it in front of you.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 2, 2018
  10. FLQuacker

    FLQuacker Member Full Member Thread Starter

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    Yeah...would prob get everything prior to cutting it.

    This cherry is heavy, by my calcs a little north of 3.5 lbs per brd ft!
     
  11. Arn213

    Arn213 craM de la craM # RipJack City! Full Member

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    An example is if you had a body wood and neck wood (let us just say as an example from the same specie out of genuine mahogany) that is 3 pounds per board foot, you should net around 9 pounds and up on a finished guitar. So at 3.5 lbs. per board foot, an actual body blank would be roughly 11.9 pounds physical weight. Based on my estimation, that could be a fairly heavy guitar if you are concern about weight- the heavy weight does not infer it would not be a great sounding instrument. I personally find that a heavier instrument (the heaviest one I have weighs in at 10.4 pounds finished) actually cuts into the mix, compare to a low weight guitar.....ymmv and that is always a debate and controversy among guitarist. It only poses a question whether your son would enjoy having that much weight sling on his back/shoulders for an hour plus on a gig.

    You could weigh relieve it or chamber it, but it will only take off a little bit of weight and depending how much wood you remove, it changes the tap tone response (in a finish guitar it will sound a lot more open and airy). If you want to test what I mean, take a 4” x 12” of cherry. Start with a 3/4” thickness. Tap it on the middle several times and take note of the response (sustain and resonance). Now take, 1/8” off at a time and take note of the tap tone response. Repeat and rinse. The response will change when you remove a certain percentage of the wood. That is kind of what happens when you chamber or weight relieve or semi-hollow or hollowed out a body. You take way too much wood off, you can end up with a firewood!

    Hope is not loss though, you have options and I brought it up in your other thread about using a lightweight middle core wood and use 1/4” thickness for the top of your figured cherry (you can use a 1/4” thickness figured top for the back too). Maybe you can get a hold of that 400 year old pine. The first esquire-tele, pine was used for the body because it was lightweight and economical......it sounds great too, especially with lower output pickups.

    Hopefully @Blueglass and @Jeff M. might weigh in......
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2018
  12. Arn213

    Arn213 craM de la craM # RipJack City! Full Member

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    The curly cherry slab where you got your piece from, are there any from the logs that is cloer up the canopy and closer to the outside of the log? What I am getting at is that the wood section at the middle of the log and closes to the trunk tend to be heavier because they are more mature/older section as the tree was growing. The top end of the log are much younger, that they end up being much lighter especially if they are closer to the outside of the trunk- yes, there is a downside as the top end yield gets narrower and harder to find a clear 13-14” width for a one piece body.
     
  13. Blueglass

    Blueglass Member Full Member

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    Chambering almost certainly meansusing a top although I have plans to get around that. Chambering and using the curly cherry as a top does allow you to put all theroues under the top. My last came in at 9lbs 2 oz and weight wise I love it. You could use the cherry over swamp ash or something light.
     
  14. FLQuacker

    FLQuacker Member Full Member Thread Starter

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    Too much to think about.....I think for a first try I'll just go forward with the simple slab. Might go 1 1/2" to lighten it up a little. If it don't work out I'll have components to try again. If it's too heavy, I do all my strumming sitting down anyway....I'll keep it and try again :)

    IMG_20180802_132549352~2-612x816.jpg
     
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  15. Blueglass

    Blueglass Member Full Member

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    I say make it the normal 1 3/4" and don't worry about the weight too much. If you don't like it make another.
     
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  16. FLQuacker

    FLQuacker Member Full Member Thread Starter

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    That's what I'll do...
     
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