No idea...

[chatometry]

Hi everyone.
I found a small branch (3") of this stuff:




Quite dark just after slicing...


then it dried to a lighter brown.


The endgrain seems to perfectly match black locust, but the colour doesn't: it is brownish, with no yellow at all.
This is a ¼" endgrain detail:


and before you ask: no reaction to blacklight:


Could it be another Japanese Scholar Tree?
This below is from another recent thread where Japanese Scholar Tree was suggested:



Thanks!!!
Paolo

 

[Mr. Peet]

Golden chain tree / Laburnum anagyroides

 

[chatometry]

Thanks. All other laburnum samples I processed so far had some yellow hue:

Laburnum – PZC Chatometry

www.chatometry.com

whereas this one doesn't.
I guess some trees look more brown :)
Thanks for the suggestion!

What is the element that allowed you to discard Japanese Scholar Tree?

 

[Mr. Peet]

Did not discard the thought of Scholar tree. Work the weights and you should be able to make a few calls.

I've milled Laburnum with yellow sapwood. Think it was live wood. Milled with brown sapwood. Think it was standing dead. There are a few possibilities. Blacklight is a good start. Densities is the next step.

 

[chatometry]

Thank you. I had the same thought. I will let it dry and then do the math.
Paolo

 

[chatometry]

Hello again
Density of my mystery wood is around 740kg/m³. Eric's website lists 850 for Laburnum, and about Japanese Scholar Tree I found 700 on a website.

However I measured the chatoyance; the high value (21.1PZC) rules out most of locally grown timbers except:
- Laburnum (off for density)
- Catalpa
- Black Locust (but it lacks the yellow hue)
- Sumac (definitely not)
- possibly Sassafras

Our database for Japanese Scholar Tree only has two samples, but the values are quite low (~13).

It could also be something still not mapped within our database.
Paolo

 

[Mr. Peet]

Hello again
Density of my mystery wood is around 740kg/m³. Eric's website lists 850 for Laburnum, and about Japanese Scholar Tree I found 700 on a website.

However I measured the chatoyance; the high value (21.1PZC) rules out most of locally grown timbers except:
- Laburnum (off for density)
- Catalpa
- Black Locust (but it lacks the yellow hue)
- Sumac (definitely not)
- possibly Sassafras

Our database for Japanese Scholar Tree only has two samples, but the values are quite low (~13).

It could also be something still not mapped within our database.
Paolo

If your Blacklight is working, you have ruled out Black locust. I am not aware of any Robinia species, that do not react to blacklight. Most sumacs react to Blacklight. Sassafras lacks the 'T' / 't' tees seen in endgrain, coming off the rays. Assuming Sassafras albidum was the one you talk of. Did you have tylosis or prismatic crystals? Laburnum lacks these.

sassafras

Inside Wood - Search the Inside Wood Database - Search the Inside Wood Database

insidewood.lib.ncsu.edu

Inside Wood - Search the Inside Wood Database - Search the Inside Wood Database

insidewood.lib.ncsu.edu

Inside Wood - Search the Inside Wood Database - Search the Inside Wood Database

insidewood.lib.ncsu.edu

 

[chatometry]

Thank you (again).
I will polish the sample, vacuum it and I will take some microscope pictures.

Paolo

 

[chatometry]

I got some better pictures after polishing and vacuum cleaning.
Overall view:


¼" areas:




Do the yellowish things in the pores represent tyloses?
These are pictures from Insidewood:
Catalpa


Laburnum


rhus typhina


Black locust


styphnolpbium japonicum


I tried to fume my sample with ammonia, but there is no reaction. This confirms it is most likely NOT black locust.

Laburnum seems to me the most likely option, but I don't know if we should rule it out due to tyloses.
Thanks again
Paolo

 

[Mr. Peet]

I got some better pictures after polishing and vacuum cleaning.
Overall view:
View attachment 272074

¼" areas:
View attachment 272071
View attachment 272072
View attachment 272073

Do the yellowish things in the pores represent tyloses?
These are pictures from Insidewood:
Catalpa
View attachment 272065

Laburnum
View attachment 272066

rhus typhina
View attachment 272067

Black locust
View attachment 272068

styphnolpbium japonicum
View attachment 272070

I tried to fume my sample with ammonia, but there is no reaction. This confirms it is most likely NOT black locust.

Laburnum seems to me the most likely option, but I don't know if we should rule it out due to tyloses.
Thanks again
Paolo

View attachment 272069

No, the yellow seen are likely gums and resins or even super fine sawdust that did not come out. The tyloses look like silicates, tiny pieces of glass or even sugar. These are often hidden by sanding end grain even with vacuuming. A quick and easy is to use a razor blade and slice off a few shavings to see clean fresh wood. Be safe.

I also apologize about the Inside Wood links I posted. I thought I was posting links to individual pages, not the home page.

Do you plan to visit the site you got this wood from again? If so, look again at trees and shrubs in the area.

@phinds

 

[chatometry]

Thanks for the info and for the suggestion; I will try with a razor.

Unfortunately this log came from a tree service dump, so I have no way to know more about it :(
I am just very curious because of the high chatoyance!

Thanks again
Paolo

 

[chatometry]

I also apologize about the Inside Wood links I posted. I thought I was posting links to individual pages, not the home pa

I noticed it as well, it seems like a direct link cannot be used. Still a very good website.