Looking to buy Rengas wood (aka Borneo Rosewood)

[Arn213]

Never heard of it. If I can figure out the Chinese, I’ll see if anyone has it around. Got a litchi board that looks similar to it. Litchi any good for guitars?

Lychee- the fruitwood? They use it there for cabinetry. I have not seen it used on guitars, but it is fairly hard and heavy- too heavy for a body for sure. I have had a handful and these were figured from Hawaii. It does polish really well and has a nice golden orange-brown color way when finished.

 

[Byron Barker]

Lychee- the fruitwood? They use it there for cabinetry. I have not seen it used on guitars, but it is fairly hard and heavy- too heavy for a body for sure. I have had a handful and these were figured from Hawaii. It does polish really well and has a nice golden orange-brown color way when finished.

Yeah, I’d imagine it would be best for the guitar neck. It’s super hard wood. I’d love furniture made out of it, but it’s hard to source big pieces of it. Got more Long’an than Lychee in Taiwan.

 

[CMStewart]

Lychee- the fruitwood? They use it there for cabinetry. I have not seen it used on guitars, but it is fairly hard and heavy- too heavy for a body for sure. I have had a handful and these were figured from Hawaii. It does polish really well and has a nice golden orange-brown color way when finished.

Really hard woods can (and do) get used for backs/sides of acoustics. Ebony for instance isn't uncommon. I don't know Lychee's specs though. If it's harder than ebony, it may be useful for a fretboard.

So I think I may have found a solution. There's a company in Malaysia called YT Wood Industries selling boards of Rengas on Lazada (malaysian site) for a pretty good price. And I found someone who is a legitimate proxy shopper in Malaysia, and willing to purchase and send some to me (I'm thinking about a half-dozen). Each board will be about 48" long and 8" wide -- which means a single board can serve up to about 4 acoustic guitar backs. Another board could serve as the side pieces, and so on. It's really a great option, and the seller seems very reputable.

That said, does anyone have any experience with importing wood from Asia? I am thinking I should apply for a USDA Timber Import Permit. However, I don't know the process after that (what else may be required when receiving the wood). I would appreciate any help moving forward.

 

[Arn213]

Really hard woods can (and do) get used for backs/sides of acoustics. Ebony for instance isn't uncommon.

I was referring to body wood as in solid body wood for electric guitars. I am fairly certain with what I have here, it would be about 4 pounds per board foot and that would net an over 10 pounds plus electric guitar!

 

[Arn213]

I have shipped woods and woods shipped to me internationally. Purchase only dimensional lumber for your purpose- looks like you are buying a very small amount with a quantity of six pieces. Make sure their invoice states the common name as well as the botanical name and they fill out the custom forms properly and provide you with proper importing docs. Make sure that there are no bark attached to the wood, no bug hole/worm trails, pin holes, feces trail, punky/spalt discoloration, knots, ingrown bark, incursions, pitch pockets to bring it into the US via air transport- it will go through an X-ray when it reaches customs. Make sure you request for a fumigation certificate from your vendors if these are present. If you don’t and customs halts your parcel, it will be quarantined. They will ask you whether or not you want to pay a fumigation fee or have it destroyed.

Someone here has experience by slow boat if you want to go that route- but, I won’t recommend that for woods to be used for instruments because the longer it stays not climate controlled, the higher the chance of you receiving it with checks, cracks, deformation, etc.

As far as the dimensions that are 48” x 8” would not be the way that I would specify it to get the sets that you need. If you will build a dreadnought- modern size clears at 8” wide per panel x 2 (modern is 16”, traditional is 15-7/8” at the lower bout). You really need 8-1/2” to 9” widths for slack. If you are building an OM- an 8” width or 7-3/4” width will do (22-21” long). I would ask for separate lumber for the sides- 36” long and 5-1/2” to 6” wide. For back sets, you only need 22” long max. So the backs should be 22” plus minimum and 9-8.5” wide. IMHO.

Before you do any of the above, ask them how did they dry the wood- air dried, kiln dried, etc.. Ask them to give you a moisture content reading. You don’t want green or wood with high moisture content. You can be specific and ask them what grain cut orientation you require. Ask for material clear of knots, knot shadows and other natural defects.

 

[CMStewart]

I have shipped woods and woods shipped to me internationally. Purchase only dimensional lumber for your purpose- looks like you are buying a very small amount with a quantity of six pieces. Make sure their invoice states the common name as well as the botanical name and they fill out the custom forms properly. Make sure that there are no bark attached to the wood, no bug hole/worm trails, pin holes, feces trail, punky/spalt discoloration, knots, ingrown bark, incursions, pitch pockets to bring it into the US via air transport- it will go through an X-ray when it reaches customs. Make sure you request for a fumigation certificate from your vendors if these are present. If you don’t and customs halts your parcel, it will be quarantined. They will ask you whether or not you want to pay a fumigation fee or have it destroyed.

Someone here has experience by slow boat if you want to go that route- but, I won’t recommend that for woods to be used for instruments because the longer it stays not climate controlled, the higher the chance of you receiving it with checks, cracks, deformation, etc.

As far as the dimensions that are 48” x 8” would not be the way that I would specify it to get the sets that you need. If you will build a dreadnought- modern size clears at 8” wide per panel x 2 (modern is 16”, traditional is 15-7/8” at the lower bout). You really need 8-1/2” to 9” widths for slack. If you are building an OM- an 8” width or 7-3/4” width will do (22-21” long). I would ask for separate lumber for the sides- 36” long and 5-1/2” to 6” wide. For back sets, you only need 22” long max. So the backs should be 22” plus minimum and 9-8.5” wide. IMHO.

Before you do any of the above, ask them how did they dry the wood- air dried, kiln dried, etc.. Ask them to give you a moisture content reading. You don’t want green or wood with high moisture content. You can be specific and ask them what grain cut orientation you require. Ask for material clear of knots, knot shadows and other natural defects.

Thank you for your thoughts Arn.

The wood has been Kiln dried. I asked them if they could include documentation of the kiln treatment and they said yes. I will also ask if they can fill out the Lacey Act form. Do you think I will need to get a USDA Timber Import Permit? (it seems to be free to apply). I too would rather not use a boat if at all possible.

The widest they have is 20cm (7.874") right now. The model I want to build is based on my Breedlove, and it's 15.38" wide (20cm = 7.874", and 2 book-matched pieces will be 15.75"). So I'll have almost half an inch remaining. I need it to be about 20.2" long, so my thinking is using the 120cm (47.24") and just saw it in half (~24" on both sides). That allows a little extra height so I can position it where the grain looks best. However, I'm glad you questioned this. They do have some 20 x 60 cm pieces, and shipping twice as many pieces at that size may save money on shipping (less length/dimensional weight). I may just get a few of those, and a few 20 x 90 cm pieces (~36") for the sides. Good call.

I don't really plan on building dreadnaughts. Concert bodies (about 15.25-15.5 inches wide) is really what I'm used to, and what I'd like to build. If I want to do dreadnaughts though I will just have to use a different wood.

I am going to try to get some very straight-grained (quartersawn) pieces, free of defects. I'm just hung up mentally on the process of importing. That's all a new thing for me. :)

 

[CMStewart]

I was referring to body wood as in solid body wood for electric guitars. I am fairly certain with what I have here, it would be about 4 pounds per board foot and that would net an over 10 pounds plus electric guitar!

Gotcha. Yeah, that would be a workout to lug that around on stage. :D

 

[Arn213]

The wood has been Kiln dried. I asked them if they could include documentation of the kiln treatment and they said yes. I will also ask if they can fill out the Lacey Act form. Do you think I will need to get a USDA Timber Import Permit? (it seems to be free to apply). I too would rather not use a boat if at all possible.

When the wood is kiln dried, it can get stored several ways after that process is completed. Some will store it where it is climate controlled and some will store it in a non climate control setting. If say the wood was kiln dried to 6-8 percent moisture content and stored in a non climate controlled setting (no cooling, no heating) it can pick up moisture. That is why I ask that you request for an actual number reading. Good call on the Lacey Act and get the USDA Timber permit if it is free.

The widest they have is 20cm (7.874") right now. The model I want to build is based on my Breedlove, and it's 15.38" wide (20cm = 7.874", and 2 book-matched pieces will be 15.75"). So I'll have almost half an inch remaining. I need it to be about 20.2" long, so my thinking is using the 120cm (47.24") and just saw it in half (~24" on both sides). That allows a little extra height so I can position it where the grain looks best. However, I'm glad you questioned this. They do have some 20 x 60 cm pieces, and shipping twice as many pieces at that size may save money on shipping (less length/dimensional weight). I may just get a few of those, and a few 20 x 90 cm pieces (~36") for the sides. Good call.

I was trying to just give you flexibity just in case you want to build a larger pattern and with that said it will just give you better versatility, but at this point you are at the mercy of the size they have available. That size you should still be able to do a tight dreadnought an you can add a center strip of contrasting wood with it.

Yes, you are better being selective on the size and how many pieces you need when you ship by air as it can get very expensive. It probably works out anywhere from $ 12-$10 per pound depending what country it is coming from. My calculation that a board that is 48” x 8” x 1” thickness will weigh ~ 11.33 pounds or 11 pounds dead even (about 4.25 pounds per board foot based on average dried weight for this species, that is comparable/hair more per board foot than hard maple).

Be cautious too as some shipping courier has a shipping up charge if the package is over 48”.

 

[CMStewart]

When the wood is kiln dried, it can get stored several ways after that process is completed. Some will store it where it is climate controlled and some will store it in a non climate control setting. If say the wood was kiln dried to 6-8 percent moisture content and stored in a non climate controlled setting (no cooling, no heating) it can pick up moisture. That is why I ask that you request for an actual number reading. Good call on the Lacey Act and get the USDA Timber permit if it is free.



I was trying to just give you flexibity just in case you want to build a larger pattern and with that said it will just give you better versatility, but at this point you are at the mercy of the size they have available. That size you should still be able to do a tight dreadnought an you can add a center strip of contrasting wood with it.

Yes, you are better being selective on the size and how many pieces you need when you ship by air as it can get very expensive. It probably works out anywhere from $ 12-$10 per pound depending what country it is coming from. My calculation that a board that is 48” x 8” x 1” thickness will weigh ~ 11.33 pounds or 11 pounds dead even (about 4.25 pounds per board foot based on average dried weight for this species, that is comparable/hair more per board foot than hard maple).

Be cautious too as some shipping courier has a shipping up charge if the package is over 48”.

Thanks Arn for all the thoughts.

I spoke to a guy at the USDA today about the Timber Permits, and what to expect. He was really helpful. So I think I'll apply online (he said turnaround time is much quicker online), and once I have that I should move forward with a small order at first, and if it goes well order more later.

I think that's what I'll do. Crossing my fingers that everything will work out :)

 

[stevlajang]

hi greetings from indonesia.. yupp rengas such a beast tonewood for neck & especially BS.. has some slight rosewood-esque with some thicker Midrange.
heres 2 examples from my friends build..

 

[CMStewart]

hi greetings from indonesia.. yupp rengas such a beast tonewood for neck & especially BS.. has some slight rosewood-esque with some thicker Midrange.
heres 2 examples from my friends build..View attachment 228816
View attachment 228815

Thanks for sharing!!! Those look awesome! That's the first example I've been able to see of Rengas used for back/sides of an acoustic guitar. Till your post, I've only seen it on a ukulele.

And your description of the sound matches my experience so far. I feel it's like a cross of mahogany with some rosewood (or even ebony) type tones. Has great resonance.

I had some shipped directly from Malaysia, and bought a couple pieces from a supplier in Canada. I plan on using it for multi-piece necks and back/sides, and probably other decorative purposes (inlays, binding/purfling). Do you think it's hard enough to be used for a bridge? Is it easy/difficult to bend?

Thanks again for sharing the photos. Let me know if you have anymore tips on working with it.

All the best,
- Colby

 

[TTP GC]

Old post but I have 4 bd ft

 

[phinds]

Old post but I have 4 bd ft

Put it up in the for sale forum or the for trade forum and if not that, just put up pics in the "wood characteristics" formum so we can all see it.

 

[TTP GC]

Pictures