# Shipping



## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

Seeing quite a few posts here and elsewhere about how crappy a job the USPS does 493,400,000 (493.4 million) pcs of mail per day. Now machines do most of this. They are pretty smart machines but when J.P. Yoyo puts a 30 lb starter in a large flat rate with 2 pieces of scotch tape this is where things go wrong- starter comes out and raises hell with machine and other boxes. Your box gets beat up- not as heavy but not enough tape and all of a sudden it starts leaking contents to gum up machine even more. 
I have found there is but one way to insure box-at least boxes filled to the max with wood - to get to destiny. Liberal use of filament tape. on very heavy large boxes I go all 3 ways. Boxes get beat up but do not leak with enough tape.
But no matter what to put all the blame on USPS is not right. Have a son that works for UPS as a driver. They make good money but work horrendous hrs. and Put up with an increasing amount of crap for things way beyond their control. 
Think of this when you are mailing. filament tape is cheap if you buy online. Much cheaper than losing what you ship!!
Yikes I think I just went on another Rant- been awhile......

Reactions: Agree 6


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## woodman6415 (May 17, 2018)

Mike1950 said:


> Seeing quite a few posts here and elsewhere about how crappy a job the USPS does 493,400,000 (493.4 million) pcs of mail per day. Now machines do most of this. They are pretty smart machines but when J.P. Yoyo puts a 30 lb starter in a large flat rate with 2 pieces of scotch tape this is where things go wrong- starter comes out and raises hell with machine and other boxes. Your box gets beat up- not as heavy but not enough tape and all of a sudden it starts leaking contents to gum up machine even more.
> I have found there is but one way to insure box-at least boxes filled to the max with wood - to get to destiny. Liberal use of filament tape. on very heavy large boxes I go all 3 ways. Boxes get beat up but do not leak with enough tape.
> But no matter what to put all the blame on USPS is not right. Have a son that works for UPS as a driver. They make good money but work horrendous hrs. and Put up with an increasing amount of crap for things way beyond their control.
> Think of this when you are mailing. filament tape is cheap if you buy online. Much cheaper than losing what you ship!!
> Yikes I think I just went on another Rant- been awhile......


Great rant .. I couldn’t agree more .. my mail carrier is a great person .. because mail theft is bad here in the rural area she sends me a text every time she puts a package in my mailbox ..

Reactions: Way Cool 2


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## Sprung (May 17, 2018)

I agree - these flat rate boxes really aren't designed to hold as much weight as we regularly put in them shipping wood. Yeah, they say, "If it fits, it ships = up to 70lbs." But these boxes aren't designed for that, nor is the padded envelope. Then you run into the issues above if you don't prepare the package properly.

I have noticed a few more problems with USPS lately compared to normal. But even with having a few recent packages bounce around between sorting stations for 2 or so weeks before finally being sent on to where they actually need to be, I have never, in hundreds of packages that I have sent out, had a lost package from USPS. And have never had a package that I have sent arrive with lost contents. I view the amount of tape used as a crucial element. I don't use filament tape, but I do use the Scotch Heavy Duty Shipping Tape, which I buy in an 8-pack at Costco. Way better than the cheap stuff - thicker and stronger.

Now, I have received plenty of packages that were busted open, even sometimes missing some or all of their contents. What did every single one of those packages have in common? The sender poorly packed the items and/or didn't use enough tape. Boxes should get tape in all three axes. (Plural of "axis", not "ax".)

Trying to do insurance claims with USPS is a nightmare and they will try to find any excuse not to pay. At least that's been my experience.

A few cents worth of extra tape is really cheap insurance.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

Sprung said:


> I agree - these flat rate boxes really aren't designed to hold as much weight as we regularly put in them shipping wood. Yeah, they say, "If it fits, it ships = up to 70lbs." But these boxes aren't designed for that, nor is the padded envelope. Then you run into the issues above if you don't prepare the package properly.
> 
> I have noticed a few more problems with USPS lately compared to normal. But even with having a few recent packages bounce around between sorting stations for 2 or so weeks before finally being sent on to where they actually need to be, I have never, in hundreds of packages that I have sent out, had a lost package from USPS. And have never had a package that I have sent arrive with lost contents. I view the amount of tape used as a crucial element. I don't use filament tape, but I do use the Scotch Heavy Duty Shipping Tape, which I buy in an 8-pack at Costco. Way better than the cheap stuff - thicker and stronger.
> 
> ...


Agree on all points-Used to use same tape- and still do on PE. changed to filament tape on bigger boxes- you cannot tear it. I buy both by the case online.


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## pinky (May 17, 2018)

I agree on tape recommendation, but a box should Not show up like this.

https://woodbarter.com/threads/usps-not-withstanding-thank-you-john.35296/


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## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

pinky said:


> I agree on tape recommendation, but a box should Not show up like this.
> 
> https://woodbarter.com/threads/usps-not-withstanding-thank-you-john.35296/


 Note quite sure what you mean- If box needs more tape to keep it together is the PO supposed to stop and rewrap every one. I had 2 boxes arrive this week busted open. Both lacked sufficient tape. I have shipped in excess of 250 packages this year- some to arrive beat up but to my knowledge nothing was lost. 
Machines do most of the work- heavy boxes need LOTS of tape. JMO-but senders job Not PO's


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## Lou Currier (May 17, 2018)

At least it appears that they got all the guts put back in...if it was UPS all you would’ve gotten was a box.


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## pinky (May 17, 2018)

@Mike1950 
Mike, I'm just curious, are you mostly wrapping cardboard around wood and taping it up or do you send a lot of flat rate boxes?

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

pinky said:


> @Mike1950
> Mike, I'm just curious, are you mostly wrapping cardboard around wood and taping it up or do you send a lot of flat rate boxes?


80% USPS 20% fedex. EDIT: all USPS are flat rate. 
Lost 1 box- @TMAC 4 yrs ago- persimmon- heavy LFR. Hardly any tape. disappeared in memphis- My assumption- it was lucky to get that far- 90 days I got my money back. I sent new package right away- Tim was more than understanding. Talked to my postal Lady. She explained what happened. as They have gotten busier and busier I add more tape.
If desired I will post a picture of next heavy box I send out- in fact 2 LFR full of pen blanks today. I will picture.
also if you are shipping wet wood that is not sealed. Line box with plastic. water weakens the USPS boxes fast- wet cardboard is useless cardboard. Plastic in there eliminates this problem fast. I know someone- used to be member here that lost $4K worth of burl pen blanks this way and still will not acknowledge any blame....

Reactions: Like 1


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## rocky1 (May 17, 2018)

Package pictured lacked tape and peanuts. Voids in packing create issues as well. Bubble wrap is dirt cheap to. Fill the void so contents can't shift and the box will fair much better when dropped.

Yes, they all get thrown around, and some are going to be damaged, but if packed properly, and taped extensively, most will survive.

And, if you guys think you have headaches and room to bitch about packages...

Kona Queen out off Hawaii shipped 10,000 Queens in a multiple destination shipment this spring. That's a normal day for them. Value of $25 each. Cannot insure a live bug when shipping, at all. Someone lost the entire shipment for days! Live bees do not fair well in hot environments, they need air movement, they need water, they didn't have either. Kona had to eat the loss.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Lou Currier (May 17, 2018)



Reactions: Funny 1 | Way Cool 1


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## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

rocky1 said:


> Package pictured lacked tape and peanuts. Voids in packing create issues as well. Bubble wrap is dirt cheap to. Fill the void so contents can't shift and the box will fair much better when dropped.
> 
> Yes, they all get thrown around, and some are going to damaged, but if packed properly, and taped extensively, most will survive.
> 
> ...



Very good points- Those of you that have gotten blackwood blanks from me know I shrink wrap 10 together and then fill voids with real packing peanuts. Other wise those heavy blanks become missiles inside box and proceed to exit quickly. These heavy boxes get beat up bad. You can get in excess of 4o lbs of ABW blanks in a LFRGB. and let me tell you when the mail person grabs it you are sure to get the stinkeye look.....

YIKES $250K a day in bees.. I am amazed- never would have guessed that demand.....


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## rocky1 (May 17, 2018)

Yep... With colony collapse and other loss factors an ever present thing, beekeepers are constantly growing new hives to make up losses and maintain numbers. The federal government started a program a few years back to assist beekeepers with their losses, part of the program requirement is reporting your losses, so everyone had to start counting hives on a monthly basis. I was doing that before they came out with the requirement because I knew it was coming in the program. But... Counting numbers reaffirmed what we already knew, and that is, we were/are growing/replacing 100% of the operation annually.

Guy I went to high school with, his son decided to go into the bee business. Talked with the old man one day at the store and he said this is the only industry he knew of that you had to work your ass off growing, to simply stand still.


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## pinky (May 17, 2018)

rocky1 said:


> Package pictured lacked tape and peanuts.
> 
> That box couldn't fit a peanut. Stuffed solid. If you look at the pictures, the box is ripped up on 3 sides, machine ripped it up, tape wouldn't have made a difference on this one. However, I agree boxes should be filled with peanuts or other material and filament tape should be used. I screwed up sending one out to Mike last week. Not my usual packing procedure but ran out of filament and took a chance. Oh well, replacement was mailed yesterday, hoping it gets there intact.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

Lfr with 160 bab pen blanks. I want it to get there.

Reactions: Like 1 | +Karma 1


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## pinky (May 17, 2018)

@Mike1950

That is a work of art!

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Mike1950 (May 17, 2018)

pinky said:


> @Mike1950
> 
> That is a work of art!


Thanks- I have lots of practice.....


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## Allen Tomaszek (May 30, 2018)

Ditto on the tape. Throughout the year I ask a few random customers to send me a picture of how their package showed up just so I can see how well my packaging is holding up.

When I first started shipping one thing that consistently produced crushed/torn boxes is the presence of a void on the inside of the box. Make sure your boxes are packed full with something to eliminate the air space (wadded up newspaper, packing peanuts, cardboard, another piece of wood).

Then I put a ridiculous amount of tape on the ends especially. The packages below were shipped fedex from Milwaukee to Texas and if I recall were somewhere between 30-50lbs each.

Once I started doing all the above I haven’t had a single complaint of a damaged package Shipped by fedex, ups, or USPS.

Now watch. With my luck the next package I send will fall apart before it even leaves the city.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


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