# HSS vs Carbide for learning.



## chevy572 (Sep 10, 2017)

I'm getting into turning want to know which is better for learning. Should I just learn on HSS for better cuts or just learn faster on carbide cutters? I will be using burls and rough logs off my land for bowls, pens, etc.. I was just wanting to know which should I go with for learning on rough green logs and burls. Would also like to know the tools ill need for bowl turning and maybe spindles. TIA


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## woodtickgreg (Sep 10, 2017)

You will get many varied answers to this question. I think most folks should learn with traditional tools first and then carbide. I don't think one style of tool should be favored over another and that both styles of tools should be in a turners arsenal. I'm probably a little different than most turners in that I learned with traditional tools and now use carbide more than others. But that's just me. Some people think that carbide are for learning, I disagree with that. There is no one tool or style of tool that is the best. But when I am turning I will grab a carbide tool first!
To each there own. Traditional tools are a little more difficult to learn but I think everyone should know how to use them. Carbides are far easier and safer and don't waste a ton of time constantly sharpening them like traditional tools. Carbide can cause more tearout and require more sanding depending on the wood, it's hardness and integrity, and the style of cutter used.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Schroedc (Sep 10, 2017)

I'm with Greg, learned with traditional tools but use carbide a lot these days. Sounds like you plan to use a lot of green wood for bowls, learn the gouge, it's fast to rough out once you learn it. And mastering the skew will be great but if you only want to learn one type, carbides have the fastest learning curve.


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## woodtickgreg (Sep 10, 2017)

And one thing to remember about carbides, crank up the speed, they love high speeds! They will cut clean, fast and not want to dig in as much with higher speeds.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## rocky1 (Sep 10, 2017)

Carbide can be a bit aggressive, but that's going to be largely dependent upon what kind of stock you're playing with. Personally, I'd learn traditional tools first, I find them a little more forgiving than carbide on less dense woods and cast resins.


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## sprucegum (Sep 10, 2017)

Just purchased my first carbide tools they are great. Having said that I really can't afford to replace all of my many HHS and carbon steel tools with carbide. I would look for a good used set of HHS tools and add a few good carbide tools as you figure out which ones you use the most.


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## Woodworking Vet (Sep 10, 2017)

I learned with traditional tools and continue to use them today. I have yet to use a carbide turning tool. My two favorite go to tools are my bowl gouges and skews, those two alone can do most of my work whether bowl or spindle turning. A couple of things to keep in mind. With traditional tools you'll need a way to sharpen so figure a sharpening system of some sort into your budget. It can be something as simple as a slow speed grinder and home made jig (or free hand) or something more elaborate like a Tormek system. With carbide you just rotate your blade and then replace it when its time. When considering traditional tools many tools have different grinds. Bowl gouges for example have different profiles for various purposes, for that reason I have three bowl gouges. When properly sharpened and used a traditional tool can give you a very very clean surface. Though I haven't used carbide tools my opinion is that a traditional tool will give you a cleaner cut with less tear out than a carbide tool when dealing with burl. Traditional bowl gouges are fun to use on green wood as well. Like others have said, it is a very personal choice on which to use. Before you spend money on a lathe and tools I would highly suggest getting with a turning club or at least another turner nearby and turn some wood. You may have a chance to try out both types of tools before spending your money. Welcome to turning!!


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## chevy572 (Sep 10, 2017)

Thanks for all the input guys and @Woodworking Vet there isnt any turners within 2 county's of me and aren't any turning clubs with 3-4 hours so i'm going have to do which ever one I think will be better in the log run.


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## rocky1 (Sep 10, 2017)

You'll be surprised once you get into it. Turners are everywhere, you just don't know it until you get involved and others start pointing them out to you Dalton. Didn't think there were any around me that turned, then @Spinartist who lives slap on the other end of the state, 350 miles away, told me he had a friend that lives in town here that turns. Met Bob, and his son who lives here, turns as well. 

My mom had pointed out an article in the local paper about a guy lives right across the river in a neighboring community that turns, and Bob has since told me there's another gentleman over there that turns. Someone else here in town was turning, as they've sold 2 - 3 larger lathes on Craigslist, and the pictures weren't in Bob's shop. If those sold locally, there are least two more turners doing way more than pens and keychains. 

Two counties away, there's a rather large active club, in a very small community, with many active members, that I really need to get down and visit. Gonna hitch a ride with Bob one of these days, and go see what I might learn down there. 

But yes... Just getting started, turners nearby can be tough to find.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Schroedc (Sep 10, 2017)

@chevy572 - post a thread in the meet up area, put the title as "Looking for turner near (wherever you are)"

That way you might find one on here that is near you to show you a few things.


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## woodtickgreg (Sep 10, 2017)

Carbides can be sharpened on a flat diamond hone very easy, they don't have to be thrown away when dull like the manufacturers want you to believe, that's how they sell product. And turning green wood with carbides is just as fun as a traditional tool, the chips really fly off! Some of the thing I like the best about carbides is that you just hold the tool flat on the rest and parallel with the floor, all the energy is then transferred down into the rest, catches are minimal or non existant. You don't have to concentrate on riding the bevels, you just cut and concentrate on your form. I can almost do an entire turning with just one tool, I can take delicate light cuts or heavy hogging cuts. Here is an example, I cut the entire form of this hollow bowl with a square cutter, hollowed most of the inside before switching to a hollowing tool that I made to undercut the rim. Remember that carbides like higher speeds. This was just me messing around with my new lathe when I first got it. Just watch and you will see what can be done with carbides and a green soaking wet blank. I don't talk, I just turn and let the form come out. Nay sayers should watch too before forming a solid opinion against carbides, they are just dang fun imo. Nothing wrong with traditional tools, I learned with them, but I have come to enjoy turning with carbides more, but that's just me.

Reactions: Like 1


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## chevy572 (Sep 10, 2017)

@woodtickgreg can you still turn burls and sawn logs as easy on carbide never see anybody on youtube or anywhere use carbide for rough cutting bark and odd shape logs. If so you probably sold me on carbide.


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## woodtickgreg (Sep 10, 2017)

chevy572 said:


> @woodtickgreg can you still turn burls and sawn logs as easy on carbide never see anybody on youtube or anywhere use carbide for rough cutting bark and odd shape logs. If so you probably sold me on carbide.


My absolute favorite roughing tool is a rounded square carbide, just like the one I am using in the video. Heavy roughing cuts are easy and all the enrgy is transfered down into the tool rest, catches are minimal if at all. Just keep picking up the speed as the blank comes into round and balance. I used to hate roughing with traditional tools, not anymore, easy peasy with the square carbide. I often have to wear a glove on one hand (an absolute no no on a machine) because the chips come off so fast and hot that they will actually burn my hand and beat it up. I never touch anything with that gloved hand and I don't recommend anyone wear a glove when turning, that's the biggest safety violation you could ever do! But it just proves a point about how well carbides can work and why I have pretty much switched over to them completely. I still have my traditional tools but I rarely use them anymore.


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## Schroedc (Sep 11, 2017)

woodtickgreg said:


> My absolute favorite roughing tool is a rounded square carbide, just like the one I am using in the video. Heavy roughing cuts are easy and all the enrgy is transfered down into the tool rest, catches are minimal if at all. Just keep picking up the speed as the blank comes into round and balance. I used to hate roughing with traditional tools, not anymore, easy peasy with the square carbide. I often have to wear a glove on one hand (an absolute no no on a machine) because the chips come off so fast and hot that they will actually burn my hand and beat it up. I never touch anything with that gloved hand and I don't recommend anyone wear a glove when turning, that's the biggest safety violation you could ever do! But it just proves a point about how well carbides can work and why I have pretty much switched over to them completely. I still have my traditional tools but I rarely use them anymore.



I keep thinking about the chip deflector you can get for the EWT tools.... I bet it'd fit yours you make..

As far as the glove, yep, that's one of those do as I say, not as I do things. I've done it a time or two myself for the same reason as you did and DO NOT recommend anyone do it but I've generally gone to just sticking a strip of duct tape to the edge of my hand these days and it does the same job without the grab hazard of a glove.....

Reactions: Like 1


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## woodtickgreg (Sep 11, 2017)

Yup, the ewt chip guard will fit my tools..
Good tip on the duct tape.


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## David Hill (Sep 11, 2017)

I started wilth carbides then learned the "traditional" tools. I guess that makes me a "hybrid" turner. I use both tool types.
The carbides have the advantage of a smaller learning curve. I used to think that I'd be spending a lot of time sharpening the traditional tools--again, it's a learning curve. I really like what a scary sharp tool does in terms of smoothness.
I use my carbides mostly now for removing (hogging) out larger amounts of material and when I want to smooth out where I've done inlay as they fare better than the gouges on tolerating that. And yes the carbides can be sharpened with the diamond cards--won't get a factory edge, but it'll be close.

Reactions: Like 1


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