# vinegar and steel wool do's and don'ts



## Treecycle Hardwoods

Ok I want to try my hand at making some hard maple black..... I have heard/read that this can be done with almost any wood using steel wool and vinegar. I was wondering however the best methods to do this? I was thinking of doing the vac chamber because I wanted to get the color in before turned it. I was also wondering what ratio of vinegar:steel wool I should use. I am hoping to achieve a black close to ebony, any help in with these questions would be greatly appreciated.


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## Treecycle Hardwoods

I just thought of this @TurnTex I only have one vacuum chamber if I go that rout to get the color into the maple what cleaning/care should I take with my chamber to insure I don't mess up my next batch of cactus juice i put thru it?


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## Mike1950

Greg I think it works best with woods that have a lot of tannins in it- don't think maple is one of them- why not dye.......

Reactions: Agree 3 | Informative 1


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## Treecycle Hardwoods

Mike1950 said:


> Greg I think it works best with woods that have a lot of tannins in it- don't think maple is one of them- why not dye.......


 I spose I could dye it but I don't have black dye and I won't be in the vicinity of WC or Rockler for several weeks. I was told to use a sharpie after it is turned but that isn't the most appealing to me. I was hopping this would work for me....


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## Mike1950

Not sayin it won't but I would test a piece first- I don't think it will be ebony dark.


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## Tclem

I was over at @robert flynt house and I am thinking he showed me some stuff that would turn maple black. Am I thinking crazy Robert ?

Reactions: Like 1


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## DavidDobbs

I don't think your going to see real dark maple. I just put a couple blanks in my mixture and it only tinted s tiny bit.
It is the tannin (sp) in the Oak,Walnut, Osage has the reaction to the mix.

Dave

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Mike1950

Tclem said:


> I was over at @robert flynt house and I am thinking he showed me some stuff that would turn maple black. Am I thinking crazy Robert ?




Let's ask @SENC

Reactions: Funny 2


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## SENC

Mike1950 said:


> Let's ask @SENC


Is there any doubt? He is a few fruit loops short of a full bowl, you know.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Kevin

Greg try it anyway so you can speak from actual experience. These guys are all 1 clown short of a circus, and a few hundred cuss words short of a poker game.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## DavidDobbs

I put some in my soak soft & hard maple. So we will know in a bit.

Dave


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## Kevin

DavidDobbs said:


> So we will know in a bit.



Not really. Leave it in for month.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## barry richardson

Like Mike said, my understanding is that it works best with high tanin woods, walnut, oak, etc. At any rate, hard maple is so dense I don't think it will absorb much of anything. I dont have a vacuum chamber, but I once tried to ebonize walnut using the oil-steel wool method, I sliced the walnut thin and submerged the pieces in the solution for a day or so, and it still only turned it black maybe 1/16" of depth. I'm interested to see how yours turns out. I like using hard maple for finials cause it is cheap and takes detail so well, but I usually just color it with india ink or black lacquer after turning...

Reactions: Informative 2


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## TurnTex

Treecycle Hardwoods said:


> I just thought of this @TurnTex I only have one vacuum chamber if I go that rout to get the color into the maple what cleaning/care should I take with my chamber to insure I don't mess up my next batch of cactus juice i put thru it?


All you would need to do for your chamber is wash it out with dish soap and water and then thoroughly dry it before stabilizing in it again.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## DavidDobbs

I use what they call high vinegar not the store bought 5%. It works on wood with tannin fast. like in seconds. If you take a blank back out it will change
start to blacken. The maple that I put in a bit ago is just soaking the color or the rust......

Reactions: Informative 1


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## ripjack13

What about liquid shoe polish?


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## Treecycle Hardwoods

barry richardson said:


> Like Mike said, my understanding is that it works best with high tanin woods, walnut, oak, etc. At any rate, hard maple is so dense I don't think it will absorb much of anything. I dont have a vacuum chamber, but I once tried to ebonize walnut using the oil-steel wool method, I sliced the walnut thin and submerged the pieces in the solution for a day or so, and it still only turned it black maybe 1/16" of depth. I'm interested to see how yours turns out. I like using hard maple for finials cause it is cheap and takes detail so well, but I usually just color it with india ink or black lacquer after turning...


I was chasing the maple idea because of how it holds detail like you said. I may play around with walnut as I have oodles of the stuff and it also turns well. I am looking to make a collar and finial for that willow burl piece I posted in my proportions thread. I filled some voids with crushed lapis stone which is blue. I may still go with maple and dye it blue to match the stone inlay. I will give it some thought. Thanks everyone fir the help I'm gonna sleep on this for a few days and then wrap this up over the weekend. I will post my results.


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## ChrisN

I've seen in a woodworking magazine something about adding tannin to the wood. It was done by brushing on liquid tannic acid (made from powder I think?) first, letting that soak in, and then applying the vinegar/steel wool mixture.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Sprung

ChrisN said:


> I've seen in a woodworking magazine something about adding tannin to the wood. It was done by brushing on liquid tannic acid (made from powder I think?) first, letting that soak in, and then applying the vinegar/steel wool mixture.



I've not tried to the vinegar/steel wool yet, but to add to what Chris said here - I've read a number of times of people brewing a real strong cup of tea and brushing it on woods low in tannin before applying the vinegar/steel wool dye. Tea is high in tannins. Can't say I've tried this, though I might someday.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 1


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## Mike Jones

I put a pen blank into a vinegar/steel wool mix in a quart jar. I'm remembering something like three weeks to get the soak all the way through and another 2 weeks to dry it out. It was black. The better, faster way to get an ebony finial it to make it, seal it, then coat it with boot black (liquid shoe dye). India ink does well also, but aniline dyes and dyes for lacquer have a lot of blue in them.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Blueglass

Why not try it on oak it is plenty common and if you mess up not a huge loss. I love oak grain, I just have noticed it is not the most stable so don't use it much.


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## Treecycle Hardwoods

Blueglass said:


> Why not try it on oak it is plenty common and if you mess up not a huge loss. I love oak grain, I just have noticed it is not the most stable so don't use it much.


in this case i will be making a finial and collar with it and i need the wood to hold detail because of how small and delicate the finial will be. Oak is not a good wood for that.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## DKMD

I refer to the vinegar/steel wool mixture as woodturner's douche(WTD).

I've used walnut and oak... Both worked well. I just threw a wad of steel wool into about 6 ounces of vinegar and left it for a week or so until it dissolved. I've read recommendation to strain it through a coffee filter to remove the steel particles... Otherwise they might rust at some point down the road. I've never strained mine.

The tea trick I've read about but never tried.

I'm not sure the vacuum chamber will work, but I'm interested to see your results if you try it. I may be wrong, but I think it requires oxygen to work... I'm probably way off base on that point.

Sharpies seem to have a kinda of bluish tint that I don't like. Ink works, but the stuff I've tried also has a bluish cast. I've gone to using the alcohol based dye from CSUSA when I'm trying to ebonize something. Although I've never used the black version, I've used RIT dye for coloring stuff previously... The knock against RIT is that it's not colorfast. I've seen shoe polish used, but I've never done it myself.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Treecycle Hardwoods

Ok here is what I did. No color no vinegar I will save that for another day and project. I was looking for a super white hard maple board I have and found a nice piece of apple. Apple holds detail very well also do I said what the heck let's do it! Just sprayed a coat of lacquer on it before the pic.

Reactions: Like 4


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## ironman123

Very nice Greg.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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