# Setup Help!!



## Ben Holt (Mar 11, 2016)

Not sure where to put this thread, so feel free to move.
Ok...On my behalf, the first time I have ever used a lathe was a month or so ago. My friend was interested in having a handle made for a piece of firesteel. I told him I would give it a shot. The whole experience was not pleasant. Please take at the below pics and tell me where I went wrong or what potentially could be wrong. I'm kind of at a loss. Also, if you can recommend a better way of doing it, I'm all ears. I only use the mandrel at this point with pens, so I haven't turned between centers, nor know how to correctly do it. :(


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## Schroedc (Mar 11, 2016)

Ok, Looks like however you were supporting your piece it slipped to one side. Can you show pictures of the center of the piece and how you were holding everything?

Was the stub on the jacobs chuck going into a hole on the piece or just pressing it up against the tailstock? If it was pressing the piece up against the tail and it just has a flat face there isn't anything to hold it in place. Also- if you drilled the hole for the steel first and whatever protrudes into that hole isn't big enough it's going to slide to the side.


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## Schroedc (Mar 11, 2016)

My suggestion to correct this if it's what I think it was,

Drill hole into the piece the diameter you need for inserting the fire steel, Take the correct sized punch from your disassembly punches and chuck that into the jacobs chuck, then press in with the tailstock and that should hold it. The only issue you might have is that if it's a fairly small hole you might not get enough friction to hold it in place and it'll want to spin on the shaft. Plus the punch might want to deflect as you turn causing chatter

Another option and the one I might try first- do your punches have a point on one end? if they do have a point, use the same big one, spin it around in the chuck so the point is poking into your work piece and that point biting into the center of the wood could be enough to keep it from sliding over, also, many light cuts, if you get too aggressive things like to move when you're jam chucking like that.


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## duncsuss (Mar 11, 2016)

I can't see what you've got in the headstock -- a Jacobs chuck with something in its jaws?

Do you have a drive spur? (a.k.a. spur drive center)


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## Ben Holt (Mar 11, 2016)

Sorry for the delay guys...I drilled the piece of burl and epoxied the firesteel in place. I then put the firesteel in the chuck and turned it like that. The wood should have been stabilized but I didn't figure that out until it was too late. It was difficult to turn.


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## Schroedc (Mar 11, 2016)

For it to be off center like that, something wasn't straight in the chucking. I'm wondering if the jacobs chuck drifted loose or if the tape wrapped on the fire steel threw it off. when you rotated it by hand did it look like the fire steel was rotating in a circle around the center axis or did it still run true?


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## Ben Holt (Mar 11, 2016)

The only thing that I can come up with is that I didn't drill it straight and then the chuck came loose during turning to compound the problem. The piece I started with was too big for my centering chuck, so I just chucked it the best I could. I was thinking any issues would "turn" themself out. I'm trying to figure out a way that I could use a mandrel and bushings but I don't want a hole on the top of the handle. I think if the wood would have been harder, I would have had better success. It was obvious the (free-spinner?? whatever its called) dug into the wood quite a bit.


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## Schroedc (Mar 11, 2016)

Using a jacobs chuck in the headstock can be problematic, Mine has a draw bar of threaded rod with a big nut on the outboard side of the headstock to keep it form drifting out. wiht that you could have possibly turned it without the tailstock up to the piece. I'd recommend looking at a collet chuck like a lot of the call makers use to grab the steel if you want to glue them in first. What I'll do regularly is turn a round tenon on the blank using a drive center and live center and then use my 4 jaw chuck to grab the tenon and hold that while I turn and then part off the tenon when I'm done.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13 (Mar 11, 2016)

If you want to use the mandrel, you can plug the hole at the end after, and sand it smooth....


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## JR Custom Calls (Mar 11, 2016)

The ideal way to turn that would be with a 60 degree dead center, and a 60 live center.


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## Ben Holt (Mar 11, 2016)

JR Custom Calls said:


> The ideal way to turn that would be with a 60 degree dead center, and a 60 live center.


Sorry...serious question. Why do u recommend this setup? Thx


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## JR Custom Calls (Mar 11, 2016)

Ben Holt said:


> Sorry...serious question. Why do u recommend this setup? Thx


Because the centers tapered at 60 degrees would keep the piece perfectly centered (provided your lathe is half way lined up), and no chance of throwing crap all over the garage like you get with a jacobs chuck. Same principal applies with turning pens between centers. The tapered centers fit in the tubes perfectly centered, minimizing runout that you'd get with a mandrel that has even a slight bend in it.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## duncsuss (Mar 11, 2016)

There are many options, some of which I've learned are less successful than others.

A piece of cork (drink the wine after you're done turning, not before or during) or leather or even a wood chip between the live center in the tailstock and your workpiece will stop it digging a hole in the end.

I strongly recommend a book by 'Doc' (Clarence) Green called Fixtures and Chucks for Woodturning. It covers many techniques for mounting wood safely and effectively.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1 | Great Post 1


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## Schroedc (Mar 11, 2016)

JR Custom Calls said:


> Because the centers tapered at 60 degrees would keep the piece perfectly centered (provided your lathe is half way lined up), and no chance of throwing crap all over the garage like you get with a jacobs chuck. Same principal applies with turning pens between centers. The tapered centers fit in the tubes perfectly centered, minimizing runout that you'd get with a mandrel that has even a slight bend in it.



The only issue I see and the one reason I didn't recommend this was he was trying to turn a piece with a blind hole. If he went all the way through with his hole I agree your solution is the best!


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## JR Custom Calls (Mar 11, 2016)

Schroedc said:


> The only issue I see and the one reason I didn't recommend this was he was trying to turn a piece with a blind hole. If he went all the way through with his hole I agree your solution is the best!


I didn't realize it was a blind hole. It looked to me like it had whatever that diy mandrel was all the way through the other side.


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## rocky1 (Mar 11, 2016)

Do you by chance have a bottle stopper chuck Ben? --- https://www.pennstateind.com/store/PK-BS1-MJ.html

Easiest way I see to do it, would be turn it as you would a bottle stopper, remove from the chuck, and epoxy your firesteel into the handle after the fact.


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## Ben Holt (Mar 11, 2016)

rocky1 said:


> Do you by chance have a bottle stopper chuck Ben? --- https://www.pennstateind.com/store/PK-BS1-MJ.html
> 
> Easiest way I see to do it, would be turn it as you would a bottle stopper, remove from the chuck, and epoxy your firesteel into the handle after the fact.


Rocky. Thx. That might work. My only worry would be making sure I could drill the 3/8" hole afterwards straight.


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## rocky1 (Mar 11, 2016)

Ben Holt said:


> Rocky. Thx. That might work. My only worry would be making sure I could drill the 3/8" hole afterwards straight.



Your bit should follow the pilot hole where your piece was screwed on the bottle stopper chuck, if it's not locked down tight. Once you open that hole up with threads you're pretty close to 3/8" anyhow (_21/64"+threads vs. 24/64" _) and there's going to be very little resistance. You could hand drill that with a cordless drill if you take your time and not have a problem. I turned handles for 2 knockout pins and an indexing pin out of Black Walnut with that chuck, is the reason I suggested it Ben. On the indexing pin I simply drilled my hole deeper than necessary and used my bench vice to press the pin into the handle to depth, rather trying to drill it out further. That might be possible on the firesteel, eliminating epoxy, dependent upon it's diameter.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ben Holt (Mar 15, 2016)

ROUND #2: I have no idea what kind of wood. Hopefully @Tclem can awnser that, as it came out of his box of gold. Still not the setup I originally went after but went ahead and used it as a trial run again. 3/8" punch inserted with "stock" (sorry, I'm a muscle car guy") tail center. I still have to part off the end and finish but looks much better than the first go around. Please let me know your thoughts.


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## Tclem (Mar 15, 2016)

Ben Holt said:


> ROUND #2: I have no idea what kind of wood. Hopefully @Tclem can awnser that, as it came out of his box of gold. Still not the setup I originally went after but went ahead and used it as a trial run again. 3/8" punch inserted with "stock" (sorry, I'm a muscle car guy") tail center. I still have to part off the end and finish but looks much better than the first go around. Please let me know your thoughts.
> 
> View attachment 99521


Lol no idea what can come out of my shop. I have way to much and lose track sometimes. Most of the time

Reactions: Like 1


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## ironman123 (Mar 15, 2016)

Must be from someone else. If @Tclem had a nice piece like that he would of kept it.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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