# Article of Interest to Custom Knifemakers



## Kevin (Mar 26, 2016)

All Outdoor is one of a handful of weekly subscriptions I take. They always have interesting stuff to read covering a wide gamut of outdoorsy topics.

Here's an interesting read. 

The knife is nothing special for looks compared to the eye candy we see our maker's post here, but look at the sheath he had made for it. I really like the sheath because you can grab the knife without having to get a shovel to dig it out. The sheath was made by Bayou Custom Sheaths. I like their exposed-handle designs. 

I won't spoil the article for you guys. There's a humongous opportunity to ride this custom knife craze for a while to come IMO.

Reactions: Like 1 | Great Post 1


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## Kevin (Mar 26, 2016)

I forgot to ask the question I had in mind. Do you even consider that a "custom" knife? I don't because anyone can order one exactly like it. He is mass producing them from my understanding so how is it _custom_?


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## NYWoodturner (Mar 26, 2016)

If he is hand grinding them all I'd say that are still each a one off in their own right. Blanks might be water jetted but the grind would be by hand. $129 is cheap cheap cheap for a custom. Any step he could take to reduce his time would be wise. Not much of a looker but if it does the job and hold up its well worth it. AEB-L is good steel.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Molokai (Mar 27, 2016)

This is kydex sheath and you can make ten like that in time comparison to one leather sheath.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin (Mar 27, 2016)

Molokai said:


> This is kydex sheath and you can make ten like that in time comparison to one leather sheath.



I'm not referring to the material, only the style. It would be as easy to make that general style out of leather.


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## robert flynt (Mar 27, 2016)

I make a simple knife and sheath in that price range but prefer to make knives with guards and I don't like the kydex material because it is noisy and not warm like leather. To me a custom knife in one where the customer picks the blade style( his or mine), type steel and thickness, the guard and hardware material, filework pattern, if any, the shape of the handle and type handle material. If a customer buy a knife off of my table, at a show, I consider it a hand made knife. Right or wrong, I feel when a maker starts making the same thing over and over like a production line, he leave the realm of custom making and just makes hand made knives. Some people believe, if they orders it from an individual maker and it is sole authorship ( the knifemaker makes all the parts themselves) it is custom.
I have turned down a jobs where the customer wanted 16 identical knives because, as I told him, it would bore me to death. The knifemaker I referred him to still picks at me about that, because the customer has been a repeat customer. If I made knives for a living it might be different but I do it because I love doing it. I'm always experimenting with material, heat treat methods and knife styles. A Master Smith friend recently told me, he was a triditionalist, always using the same material and methods but I was always trying new steel, methods and such, when I tried to get him to try a different steel. He is right, it is what gets me up in the morning.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Kevin (Mar 27, 2016)

robert flynt said:


> Right or wrong, I feel when a maker starts making the same thing over and over like a production line, he leave the realm of custom making and just makes hand made knives.



That was my thinking also.


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## robert flynt (Mar 27, 2016)

Kevin said:


> I'm not referring to the material, only the style. It would be as easy to make that general style out of leather.


The problem with having leather ones made to shallow is, there is a real good chance of losing them, without a strap.The leather will stretch over time where the kydex won't.


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## Kevin (Mar 27, 2016)

robert flynt said:


> The problem with having leather ones made to shallow is, there is a real good chance of losing them, without a strap.The leather will stretch over time where the kydex won't.



I am aware of that. I have to repeat this frequently whenever I voice my preference for an exposed-handle style sheath. There are pros and cons to almost everything, but I dislike having to fish my knife out of a sheath so much, that I accept the added risk of the knife becoming loose in the sheath. There are ways of dealing with that also and a strap is one. Flipping a strap off becomes automatic and second nature - having to dig the knife out is never second nature. We all have our preferences.

The sheaths you made for my Persians are functionally awesome. I am having some sheaths made in the same style as what you made, except I am having some very nice ones made to do the craftsmanship of the knives the justice they deserve. I wasn't expecting any sheaths at all when you sent me the knives so that was a cherry on top. I still use those sheaths and still will in the future even when my nicer ones arrive. The nicer ones will be for display and your working sheaths will be what I carry with. Same with Tom's sheaths although I am having one of his modified to reuse as both a show and carry sheath.


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## robert flynt (Mar 27, 2016)

Want to see a truly customer? This is one I completed recently and had this lazer work done to truly customize it.

Reactions: Like 1 | EyeCandy! 2


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## robert flynt (Mar 27, 2016)

I agree Kevin, I like the cross draw sock sheath with the knife on a slight downward slant. With it belted on your front, not your side it is easier to draw.
PS: picture doesn't do the handle justice.

Reactions: Like 1


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## robert flynt (Mar 27, 2016)

One thing I meant to say is, The knife shown has a strait handle and no guard. Your hand could slip forward on to the blade and give you a nasty cut, under less than ideal conditions.


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## Kevin (Mar 27, 2016)

robert flynt said:


> Your hand could slip forward on to the blade and give you a nasty cut, under less than ideal conditions.



I never use one of the Persians for stabbing, and rarely have the need to stab anyway. I live far enough out in the country that we do not get politicians campaigning door to door.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 3


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## therichinc (Mar 28, 2016)

There are so many "Discussions" on handmade versus custom. A Custom is still handmade, and a handmade can most certainly be custom. These are just like the arguments over what the best truck is. Everyone has the "right" answer when there really is no "right" answer.

The only thing I will say about the sheath is the first time you lose a 300-500$ handmade knife you probably wont like those types of sheaths anymore...

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Kevin (Mar 28, 2016)

therichinc said:


> There are so many "Discussions" on handmade versus custom. A Custom is still handmade, and a handmade can most certainly be custom. These are just like the arguments over what the best truck is. Everyone has the "right" answer when there really is no "right" answer.
> 
> The only thing I will say about the sheath is the first time you lose a 300-500$ handmade knife you probably wont like those types of sheaths anymore...



Sounds like you have everyone's opinions already made up for them. 

I know what kind if sheath I like, and have liked since my dad first srapped one on my belt way before you were even born. I'll stick with what I like but thanks for your opinion.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## therichinc (Mar 28, 2016)

@Kevin - not sure how you took that but I meant no disrespect or harm. I was simply stating my opinion on the matter. In no way do I have peoples minds made up for them. If that was the case I would be a very busy maker haha. Just from personal experience (I have sheaths made however the customer wants them, I do voice my concerns with some patterns but in the end it is the customers call) I have had sidedraws made for people that absolutely wanted them that way only to have them come back and want a different sheath because their design didn't work exactly as they wanted. Again I meant no disrespect and hope none was taken.

now as far as the custom vs handmade discussion - that's a whole other can o beans haha, This discussion has plagued the knife community for years, as @robert flynt and a few others can attest. There are SO MANY different opinions that its hard to fathom at times. I do like to hear the different opinions though, some are humorous at best, and some that should certainly be taken seriously. What are your thoughts on it as a Knife Customer?


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## Kevin (Mar 28, 2016)

No offense taken Rich, I was just replying specifically instead of generally. I believe my preference for a sheath is valid because it's time tested _for me_, and someone's personal preference can't be made invalid by someone else's opinion.



therichinc said:


> ....What are your thoughts on it as a Knife Customer?



The discussion about what makes a knife custom etc. is a different ball of wax though. I thought I had an idea on what a custom knife is versus a handmade knife, and to what degree they can overlap, but after reading Scott and Robert's replies I don't think my opinion is valid at all (even though yes it is just an opinion). While a knife consumer such as myself can have an opinion, to me it doesn't carry the weight that the opinions of knife makers do, so I guess you could say my opinion is no longer formed on it and is still evolving as I try to understand the various opinions of knife makers.

While it may never get settled, I would have to say Flynt's explanation makes the most sense to me thus far.


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## NYWoodturner (Mar 28, 2016)

robert flynt said:


> Want to see a truly customer? This is one I completed recently and had this lazer work done to truly customize it.
> 
> View attachment 100376


Robert you do the sexiest hollow grind i've ever seen. 


I hope your wife understands knife lingo... or at least is not reading over your shoulder

Reactions: Funny 1


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## robert flynt (Mar 28, 2016)

NYWoodturner said:


> Robert you do the sexiest hollow grind i've ever seen.
> 
> 
> I hope your wife understands knife lingo... or at least is not reading over your shoulder


Thanks Scott, I used a 10" wheel, so I could grind all the way to the spine and still have a deep grind. Used trizac Gator belt down to 600 grit then a fine scotch brite belt impregnated with green rouge after that it was buffed with green rouge.

She don't pay any attention to me. She is sitting on the couch hand stitching a quilt she is making. Just doing her thing.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## robert flynt (Mar 28, 2016)

The knifemakers guild had a lot of in fighting over the definition of hand made, when makers starting out sourcing the making of parts with CNC machines. It was finally decided CNC work could only be done in house ( in the makers shop) and it had to be full disclosed to the buyer.

Reactions: Informative 1


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