# Drying Turning Stock



## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

I cut a bunch of bowl, pepper mill, pen bottle stoppers blanks and was wondering how you all dry them? Air dry? If so, how long before use? Kiln dry? If so what temp?


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## Mike1950 (Aug 19, 2022)

some you can kiln dry- some need to be sealed and dry slow. Many turn green and dry and re turn. How long? way too many variables to answer. what wood-how big?

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

Bowl blanks: 6"-12" dia. x 3" - 6" high. I would assume AD would take to long, so turn green/dry/return.

Handles/pepper mill blanks: 2"x2" or 3"x3" x 12"-15" long.

Pen blanks: 1-1/4"x1-1/14" x 6" long. Left over-sized to deal with any warpage during drying.

I was going to build a small kiln to dry the 3"x3" or smaller stuff, but I need to know what temp to run it at to prevent too fast of drying.

P.S. Harwoods, Cherry, Locust, Elm, Walnut, Oak etc.


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## Steve in VA (Aug 19, 2022)

Interesting topic with lots of variables, particularly with air drying and where you live given the temp & humidity levels. Following along as I'd love to learn more as to what others do.

I turn a lot of bowls and have great success in not getting checks by rough turning (10% of diameter for wall thickness) the bowl and allowing them to dry using a paper bag for the first month or two. After that they are removed and left on a shelf in the garage. Once they stop losing weight I consider them to be acclimated and will finish turning them whenever I get around to it or feel the itch to finish one. When I first started I also included shavings in the bags, but that held in too much moisture and resulted in mold. Paper bags alone seem to be the right balance here in VA throughout the entire year.

On the other hand, I've been a little frustrated with trying to dry blanks that are just roughed out on the bandsaw, but not rough turned to shape. For example, when I get a log I typically split it down the length of the log to eliminate the pith. I leave the length of the long a little longer than the width and immediately seal the ends with Anchor Seal. This works great and buys a fair amount of time to allow me to rough turn a bowl or whatever I have in mind for it. However, what I'd like to be able to do is round out the log on my bandsaw, seal it with Anchor Seal, and store it in the garage longer term for future use. This would save logs I can't get to in a timely manner for future use, eliminate the degrading of the logs over time, etc. Despite trying a number of things (Anchor Seal, bags, shavings, plastic wrap, etc.) it seems blanks left in this form still have a fair amount of checking whereas I've seen other have many blanks cut and stored this way. 

@Jonkou - The bowl blanks you often offer seem to be cut and stored in the manner I'd love to be able to do. I'm sure everyone would love to hear how you prep, seal, and store these as that's essentially what I'd love to accomplish. Thanks in advance!

Looking forward to hearing other methods from everyone. Great topic!

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Mike1950 (Aug 19, 2022)

I would air dry all those for a while. walnut is slow to dry. elm goes wonky if hurried. I would use a dehumidifier. you are humid, getting water out of air is key, not temps.

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## 2feathers Creative Making (Aug 19, 2022)

Dehumidification kiln plans are widely available and the kiln will not usually cost over 500 if you buy all new parts for a kiln that small. You can get by with a lot less using reclaimed materials

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## Steve in VA (Aug 19, 2022)

Refrigerator, freezer, and dishwasher kilns using lightbulbs and small computer type fans are also popular among hobby turners.

Reactions: Agree 2


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## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

Steve in VA said:


> Interesting topic with lots of variables, particularly with air drying and where you live given the temp & humidity levels. Following along as I'd love to learn more as to what others do.
> 
> I turn a lot of bowls and have great success in not getting checks by rough turning (10% of diameter for wall thickness) the bowl and allowing them to dry using a paper bag for the first month or two. After that they are removed and left on a shelf in the garage. Once they stop losing weight I consider them to be acclimated and will finish turning them whenever I get around to it or feel the itch to finish one. When I first started I also included shavings in the bags, but that held in too much moisture and resulted in mold. Paper bags alone seem to be the right balance here in VA throughout the entire year.
> 
> ...


I already do exactly what you described to the logs I get. Take a firewood round, cut out the pith and then seal the ends with an end sealer. Move blank out of the sun or into the basement. (dehumidified). Cut a bowl blank out of the half round and reseal the circumference in with hot wax. Take the remains and cut peppermill, bottle stoppers, pen blanks, etc and seal the end grain with wax.

The large bowl blanks will be rough turned as suggested and bag dried.

The smaller blanks .....?


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## 2feathers Creative Making (Aug 19, 2022)

Full size chest freezers usually have a drain hole at the bottom right corner that you can run your dehumidifier drain out. just saying...
That would allow you to have a pre built kiln and the option of light bulb/ heat kiln or small room sized dehumidifier inserted to create a dehumidification kiln. Or any combination of the two

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

Mike1950 said:


> I would air dry all those for a while. walnut is slow to dry. elm goes wonky if hurried. I would use a dehumidifier. you are humid, getting water out of air is key, not temps.


See my reply to Steve for what I've already done with them. I do have ALL roughed out blanks in the basement with two dehumidifies running (StL humidity) and end sealed.

Coincidentally, The unsealed Red Elm scraps I have in the basement haven't checked or split like other species.


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## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

2feathers Creative Making said:


> Dehumidification kiln plans are widely available and the kiln will not usually cost over 500 if you buy all new parts for a kiln that small. You can get by with a lot less using reclaimed materials


I'm in the process of building a D/H kiln to finish all the AD lumber I have. I was also going to build a 2'x2'x4'h box with a thermostat, heat source and possibly a fan to try the smaller blanks. Hence the request for operating Temp.


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## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

2feathers Creative Making said:


> Full size chest freezers usually have a drain hole at the bottom right corner that you can run your dehumidifier drain out. just saying...
> That would allow you to have a pre built kiln and the option of light bulb/ heat kiln or small room sized dehumidifier inserted to create a dehumidification kiln. Or any combination of the two


See my previous reply. What TEMPERATURE would be safe to run? Even in a chest freezer there may be too much heat from the DH that would case problems. I'm simplifying the process using a thermostat controlled heat source.


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## Mike1950 (Aug 19, 2022)

djg said:


> See my previous reply. What TEMPERATURE would be safe to run? Even in a chest freezer there may be too much heat from the DH that would case problems. I'm simplifying the process using a thermostat controlled heat source.


small blanks could go on racks downstairs also. 
Temperature. I put green maple burl straight in kiln from Oct. thru May. 80-90 degrees is ideal in beginning, after a couple weeks temp will rise in my kiln which works great. I vent to keep under 100

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## djg (Aug 19, 2022)

Mike1950 said:


> small blanks could go on racks downstairs also.
> Temperature. I put green maple burl straight in kiln from Oct. thru May. 80-90 degrees is ideal in beginning, after a couple weeks temp will rise in my kiln which works great. I vent to keep under 100


Thank You! All these blanks are for a friend and I do not want him to have to wait to use them. I see 'dried' blanks for sale here all the time, and I knew some body would know how to dry them.


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## 2feathers Creative Making (Aug 19, 2022)

djg said:


> See my previous reply. What TEMPERATURE would be safe to run? Even in a chest freezer there may be too much heat from the DH that would case problems. I'm simplifying the process using a thermostat controlled heat source.


Sorry. Apparently I skipped right over that post in my answering spree. In my defense, my breakfast appeared on the table right about then and I lost focus...
Now that I have had a moment to digest, your question that is,
@Mike1950 has gotten here first with first hand experience.









Using a Small Scale Dehumidification Kiln


Saving money by drying your lumber may not be the answer for every woodworker, but the basics shown here demonstrate that it is within the reach and skills of the average person.




www.rockler.com




This article has a basic schedule, the sizing will need adjusted to your personal kiln. But the information is intact and seems to agree with Mike so it is likely accurate. (Yes, I meant to imply that if it doesn't agree with what Mike is doing, it is likely mistaken or at least over complicated)

Reactions: Thank You! 2


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## Mike1950 (Aug 19, 2022)

2feathers Creative Making said:


> Sorry. Apparently I skipped right over that post in my answering spree. In my defense, my breakfast appeared on the table right about then and I lost focus...
> Now that I have had a moment to digest, your question that is,
> @Mike1950 has gotten here first with first hand experience.
> 
> ...


Thanks. It is simple and most way overthink it. Isulated box, dehumidifier, box fan, cheap indor outdoor thermometer. Vent box. Maybe supplental heat if you load in middle of winter to get going. Mine dries 2500 lbs of burl slabs in 6 weeks.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Useful 1


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## FLQuacker (Aug 19, 2022)

Mine...simple. Adjustable fan control motor on a fan that will draw a good draft thru it. Usually run it around 100*. Air inlet is where the wood chip tray dumps, mesh screen on it (dry finishes in it too) Outlet is removed spin top baffle with the fan box over it. These boards are at the 1 oz weight every few days now. Hard to dry anything in Fl right now otherwise! Worst part is resetting it every day for another 24 hrs...luckily I dont have to rush that much stuff.

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## barry richardson (Aug 19, 2022)

IMO drying whole bowl blanks is going to be risky no matter what you do, unless you rough turn them, then they usually dry fine, depending on the species of course...

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## Jonkou (Aug 19, 2022)

Steve in VA said:


> USER=7661]@Jonkou[/USER] - The bowl blanks you often offer seem to be cut and stored in the manner I'd love to be able to do. I'm sure everyone would love to hear how you prep, seal, and store these as that's essentially what I'd love to accomplish. Thanks in advance!


My drying method is to work in harmony with nature. For bowl blanks I use winter cut logs 18 to 20 dia cut into 4’ lengths for portability. Anchorseal the fresh cut end grain and store on pallets out of direct sun and rain for a year or more to remove the free moisture.

Trim a few inches off each end to remove checks and read the wood then cut lengths for the BEST bowl blanks, usually 2-4 per log. The remainder will be diced up for production blanks and misc. Rip cut the lengths about 1 1/4” each side of the pith (qtr sawn pieces each side of the pith) and anchor seal the end grain on the two billets. Stack in the shed for at least a year.

Power plane the high center from tangental movement to sit flat on the bandsaw table, lay out the circle template balancing the grain and bandsaw the billet into a bowl blank. Light coat of anchorseal on the fresh cuts and knots and sticker it on the shelf in the climate controlled shop until ready for use. Mark each blank with cut C date to keep track.

This method of slowing down the drying and incrementally relieving the stresses with each step of the process is simple and effective with a near 100 % success rate. Rough turned when I first moved to NH while I was figuring out the drying cycle with the seasons and like this way better. Best thing is you have full blanks at the ready and you’re not locked in to an idea you rough turned a year ago. I usually plan what I want to make then find a blank that meets the parameters vs grab a blank and see what I can make from it. Let me know if you have any questions.

Stock pile is low from COVID last few years.





Typically cut bowl blanks at 13 to 16” for traditional bowls and phi ratios for Umeke’s. Can easily resize a bigger blank if needed. A little too wet when sealed on the maple but the black is superficial and easily turns away when truing the blank.







Production blanks





Natural edge bowls wet turned to final thickness, just sand and complete the foot.

Reactions: Like 3 | Thank You! 1 | Great Post 1 | Way Cool 1 | Informative 2


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## Nature Man (Aug 20, 2022)

Outstanding tutorial! Never thought about stickering bowl blanks. Chuck

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Steve in VA (Aug 20, 2022)

Thanks John! That's exactly what I've been trying to accomplish, but the difference is all in the timing. The time you allow is much longer than what I've done as I was trying to get the blanks out of the yard and indoors much faster. Lesson learned, though my wife may not be happy when I now try to explain why the logs need to sit even longer than they have been  

One last question if you don't mind. When you first cut the logs I see you're leaving them fully round for a year plus, whereas I've been splitting mine lengthwise and removing the pith immediately. It makes sense to leave them in 4' lengths to allow trimming of the end checks, but I always thought getting the pith out right away relieved a lot of tension and helped to minimize any checking in the first place. When leaving the logs whole like you do for that first year, how much do you end up trimming off the ends? And I'm assuming leaving them in 4' lengths is better than say 2' lengths as you'd then get 2-3 times the amount of checking given twice as many ends that are now exposed?

Great info in this entire thread! Thanks everyone!!

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## Jonkou (Aug 20, 2022)

Learned lots from a Forester Bud and what we observe in nature, take a walk in the woods and study how a downed tree dries naturally. Winter cut maple and cherry are my go tos for traditional bowls, their drying schedules are very similar. Bark loosens after the first winter cycle here which means the cambium layer has lost all moisture and the sap wood has shrunk, that’s the free moisture and the log is around 30%. This is when the cell structure starts to collapses and the wood will start to deteriorate due to movement. Visit a local commercial mill and you’ll see piles of date stamped full length logs stacked for this reason.

Will typically cut a couple inches off each end of the 4 footer, then cut another thin slice and bend it to reveal any remaining checks. Trim again if needed, you get it why 4’ is better than 2’. Cut to length then READ the wood is the most critical step. If there is internal checking it can be avoided when laying out the billets thereby eliminating the weak wood. If you cut the pith out early you upset the natural drying process and shock the exposed wood into rapidly releasing moisture, you’re also guessing/hoping you remove the weak wood that will check.

If you turn a large beautiful utility bowl and etch a sweet message under the foot then leave it on the counter for her to find in the morn full of her favorite fruits she will understand.

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## Steve in VA (Aug 20, 2022)

Thanks John; great insight and appreciate you and the others willing to share your knowledge!

The advice on the sweet message is good touch as well!!

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 2


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## djg (Sep 19, 2022)

I got my small kiln loaded and running. Right now with only one 100W bulb is holding about 87 F. Too low?

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## trc65 (Sep 19, 2022)

I wouldn't think that 87° is too low, I think low and slow is the way to go until you learn a little more how your kiln setup and the wood is responding. No need to blast it with heat until you know how everything is responding. 

You probably are doing this already, but if not I'd recommend getting a notebook and recording dates, times, temp, humidity, weights, etc to learn as much as possible, or in my case to help me not forget what I learned.

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## djg (Sep 19, 2022)

trc65 said:


> I wouldn't think that 87° is too low, I think low and slow is the way to go until you learn a little more how your kiln setup and the wood is responding. No need to blast it with heat until you know how everything is responding.
> 
> You probably are doing this already, but if not I'd recommend getting a notebook and recording dates, times, temp, humidity, weights, etc to learn as much as possible, or in my case to help me not forget what I learned.


Don't hold back on comments just because you think I may know it already. Sometimes I do miss something in the planning and sometimes I need to be told more than once (memory...lol).

I have a quadrille pad that I'm recording date of when I processed the blank (assuming all was sawn green), when it goes into the kiln, species, end dimensions (2x2, pen blank, etc), rack # inside the kiln (distance from the heat source), initial weight of each block and when it get's up to temp.

Then again on check dates.

I'm a data junky; I record probably more than I need.

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