# Advice needed - closed end handle



## kweinert (Nov 21, 2012)

So, I realize I should have thought of this before I started, but I didn't.

I picked up some kits today for Christmas gifts and as I was turning the handle I realized that I'm not really sure how to finish turning the end of the handle:

[attachment=13796]

I see two ways forward:

1) turn the handle just a little bit shorter, rounding the end until there's just a small nub left, finish that part, then cut the last little bit, smooth and finish by hand.

2) mount the tenon part into a chuck and finish the end off.

I'm thinking that #1 might be the best bet here - advice to the contrary is welcome and feel free to add a 3) or 4) (or more) to my list.

And if you'd do anything differently for the next ones I'd be glad to hear that as well.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure that it'd be a lot smarter to drill the hole in the end while it's all still square.

One last thing? Any idea what kind of wood this is? I know it's not a great shot. This came from the bargain bin at the local Woodcraft and I got two pieces of this, 1 1/2 square by about 30 inches for $2 each. Since I'm not reacting to the wood and it's hard enough that it's difficult to drive the spur drive into the headstock, I think they'll do just fine as handles.

Thanks for any advice and insight.


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## duncsuss (Nov 21, 2012)

kweinert said:


> 1) turn the handle just a little bit shorter, rounding the end until there's just a small nub left, finish that part, then cut the last little bit, smooth and finish by hand.



I've made a few handles for tools (not sure what this handle is for) and I'd do it the way you describe here -- though I generally have the butt-end of the handle at the headstock rather than the orientation you show in the photo.

My approach is to turn the handle leaving extra at the butt-end, make the tenon, fit the brass ferrule, and trim the tenon -- all before drilling the hole to receive the tang of the tool.

After drilling, I use a 60 degree conical live center in the tail stock, which holds that end pretty much concentric, and shape the opposite end as near to finished as I can get.

Sand and finish, then take it off the lathe and finish off the last little nub by hand.


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## kweinert (Nov 21, 2012)

duncsuss said:


> I've made a few handles for tools (not sure what this handle is for) and I'd do it the way you describe here -- though I generally have the butt-end of the handle at the headstock rather than the orientation you show in the photo.



This is for an ice cream scoop. 

I figured out that I should have turned the handle the other way around because the spur diameter is just about exactly the diameter required for the tenon. I got through it, but much easier to turn it the other way around.

I'll cut the next one a bit longer so I have room to turn off at the length I want.

Hindsight is great and I appreciate your confirmation that if I had thought things out before I got started :dash2: this would have been easier to finish off. 



Thanks again.


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## duncsuss (Nov 21, 2012)

Ice-cream scoop? Definitely a worthy cause, then ... 

I took a workshop with Ernie Conover a few weeks back, he showed a way to drill a handle that (if done correctly) guarantees the hole is centered.

You need a drill bit chuck that fits into the headstock; push the dimple from the center against the tip of the drill bit, then bring up the tailstock behind the handle (setting the tip of the live center into the dimple at that end) and clamp it down.

Hold the handle firmly with one hand, start the lathe, and crank the tailstock quill to push the handle onto the spinning drill bit.

In principle, both ends of the handle are perfectly centered (one on the live center, the other on the drill bit) and the hole you drill therefore has to be straight and true.

When he does it, it looks easy.


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## kweinert (Nov 21, 2012)

Everything looks easy when the expert does it :)

That sounds like it is worth trying, thanks for describing the method. I'll definitely be giving it a go.


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## robert421960 (Nov 22, 2012)

for future reference if you want it
i drill my hole in the end of my handles on the lathe before doing any turning
that way if you get off any at all you can put your live center in the hole you drilled and turn it perfectly centered


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## Mike Mills (Nov 22, 2012)

I do like others and drill the hole for the tang first; sometimes on the lathe and sometimes on the drill press. I mount with a cone center in the tang hole and with the butt-end at the headstock as duncuss said. I normally round over the end with a skew as you can leave a burnished surface except for the very little nib.
If you cut too deep working at the headstock the item just drops down when you lose drive, if you cut too deep working from the tailstock the handle still has drive and can be slung.


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## Vern Tator (Nov 22, 2012)

Wow, Lots of great advice here. I was going to add a post, but I think this has been well covered. I took a hand tool class from Ernie about 15 years ago. That guy is a great teacher and has lots of very creative solutions to vexing problems. In my 42 years as a cabinet and furniture maker, his class was the best investment I ever made. I was feeling dull and uninspired before taking hes class, He changed my life!


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## duncsuss (Nov 23, 2012)

Vern Tator said:


> ... Ernie ... is a great teacher and has lots of very creative solutions to vexing problems.



Yes he is -- and a nice guy. Bet he'd be thrilled to learn that he made such a difference to your outlook.

I've forgotten his reason, but he definitely recommended making a tenon and fitting a ferrule _before_ drilling the hole for the tool shank.

Of course it doesn't matter if you get the results you want doing it the other way round


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## DKMD (Nov 23, 2012)

duncsuss said:


> I've forgotten his reason, but he definitely recommended making a tenon and fitting a ferrule _before_ drilling the hole for the tool shank.
> 
> Of course it doesn't matter if you get the results you want doing it the other way round



I haven't met Ernie, but I'd imagine he recommends the tenon and ferrel before drilling because drilling endgrain can be tough and could lead to splitting. Also, using the cone center at the tailstock as most of us seem to do would put a fair bit of stress on the area, and the ferrel would prevent problems. Also, pounding the ferrel on to a solid tenon is probably safer/easier than doing so after the piece has been drilled. As a bonus, most ferrel material like brass and copper is easy to turn and sand on the lathe with traditional tools, so you can clean it up before parting off the handle.


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## duncsuss (Nov 23, 2012)

DKMD said:


> I haven't met Ernie, but I'd imagine he recommends the tenon and ferrel before drilling because drilling endgrain can be tough and could lead to splitting. Also, using the cone center at the tailstock as most of us seem to do would put a fair bit of stress on the area, and the ferrel would prevent problems. Also, pounding the ferrel on to a solid tenon is probably safer/easier than doing so after the piece has been drilled. As a bonus, most ferrel material like brass and copper is easy to turn and sand on the lathe with traditional tools, so you can clean it up before parting off the handle.



 :whs:


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