# Toaster Oven Substitute



## aag562 (Feb 17, 2021)

Sorry for so many posts on the first day, but I nave so many questions and I always try to do my research before I venture off into the unknown. I read a few conversations on other sites, but you can't remember where, about using a food dehydrator to cook the wood once its removed from the cactus juice, I have a commercial style dehydrator that I was going to use to dry the wood and then activate the juice. Correct me if I am wrong, but the temp is 225 for catalyze the resin. Believe my machine can reach this temp. Has anyone one here used one? If I can reach proper temps do you see any downside? It is actually bigger than a large toaster. its also not going to cost me anything.


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## DLJeffs (Feb 17, 2021)

I recommend you take your questions directly to the good folks at TurnTex. They're usually really good at responding and have by far the most extensive database about the various ways people are using cactus juice.

TurnTex

Reactions: Agree 4


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## Sprung (Feb 17, 2021)

If you can be certain it will get it to 225, then it should work.

I haven't done any stabilizing in a while, but I quickly outgrew my toaster oven and switched to using an electric smoker - one like this - to dry blanks before stabilizing and to cure blanks.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Don Van Dyne (Feb 18, 2021)

I’ve heard of several casters who use dehydrators to cure blanks and dry wood. Be sure you read the instructions if using Cactus Juice. 225 is a bit high to cure. I second the recommendation above, Turn Tex can answer any question. If you read thru their site you find most answers before you ask!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sprung (Feb 18, 2021)

Man, that shows how long I've been out of it! 

Yes, 225 is too high to cure. That's a good temp for final dry down to 0% moisture content prior to stabilizing. 185 to 190 is where to cure at.

It's been almost 2 years since I've stabilized anything, so it appears I got my numbers mixed up.

Reactions: +Karma 1


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## Eric Rorabaugh (Feb 18, 2021)

Well you need to hurry up and get back in it. We miss seeing those awesome blanks!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## eaglea1 (Feb 18, 2021)

I usually shoot for 200 in the toaster oven.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Sprung (Feb 18, 2021)

Eric Rorabaugh said:


> Well you need to hurry up and get back in it. We miss seeing those awesome blanks!



Eh, maybe someday. I'm in no hurry. Even before we moved and I had to take time to set my shop back up, my woodworking was shifting back toward furniture building. The challenge is that I'm not really doing any small turnings right now - I've done so many pens and have so many on hand that I've largely run out of people to give them away to and sales were never good. And selling stabilized blanks took a lot of time and effort - time that I'd rather spend woodworking. I still have one chamber (down from my high of four) and my vacuum pump should I want or need to do some stabilizing. But at the present time, I'm in no hurry to get back into it.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Eric Rorabaugh (Feb 18, 2021)

I understand that. We do miss seeing your blanks though. I'll carry on the tradition, just send me your knowledge on double dying

Reactions: Agree 1


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## eaglea1 (Feb 18, 2021)

Matt, I think you should just probably send all those small turning blocks about 105 miles southwest of you and 
I could probably take care of them.


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## Sprung (Feb 18, 2021)

eaglea1 said:


> Matt, I think you should just probably send all those small turning blocks about 105 miles southwest of you and
> I could probably take care of them.



What I've got left, I'm hanging on to for the occasional small turning.  Plus, what I didn't clear our and sell in previous sales or in selling before moving is largely the cream of the crop, the best of the best - the stuff I won't part with, even if it's 10 years before I do anything with it.

And, shoot, being pretty new to living in WI (we moved to Kewaunee at the beginning of 2020), I didn't realize you were that close!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Sprung (Feb 18, 2021)

Eric Rorabaugh said:


> I understand that. We do miss seeing your blanks though. I'll carry on the tradition, just send me your knowledge on double dying



I've shared a lot in forum posts here. But there are some secrets one has to keep close!

Reactions: Funny 2


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## BangleGuy (Feb 19, 2021)

Sprung said:


> Man, that shows how long I've been out of it!
> 
> Yes, 225 is too high to cure. That's a good temp for final dry down to 0% moisture content prior to stabilizing. 185 to 190 is where to cure at.
> 
> It's been almost 2 years since I've stabilized anything, so it appears I got my numbers mixed up.


I just started stabilizing again last weekend and ran a few blanks through at 230F... Oops! They got hard, but my toaster was putting off a good amount of fog and fumes - had to take it outside. 

I used some cactus juice that’s 5+ years old and it worked just fine. This stuff has a long shelf life.

Reactions: Useful 1


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## Mike Hill (Feb 19, 2021)

BangleGuy said:


> I just started stabilizing again last weekend and ran a few blanks through at 230F... Oops! They got hard, but my toaster was putting off a good amount of fog and fumes - had to take it outside.
> 
> I used some cactus juice that’s 5+ years old and it worked just fine. This stuff has a long shelf life.


That's very good to know. I've got 2 gallons 3 years old. When weather breaks I'm gonna start back also.


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## DLJeffs (Feb 19, 2021)

The last couple reel seat spacers I stabilized I use my old Cactus Juice - several years old but kept tightly sealed in the bottles. Seemed to cure just fine. Like Eric mentioned, if any juice leaks out and drips on the heating element, the fumes are bad. Pretty sure they aren't good for you. Reminds me a lot of phosgene gas - don't ask me how I know that.


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## aag562 (Feb 23, 2021)

Sprung said:


> Man, that shows how long I've been out of it!
> 
> Yes, 225 is too high to cure. That's a good temp for final dry down to 0% moisture content prior to stabilizing. 185 to 190 is where to cure at.
> 
> It's been almost 2 years since I've stabilized anything, so it appears I got my numbers mixed up.


Thanks for the info i did go to their website and you are correct i had the number flip flopped


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## Turnedaround (Apr 25, 2022)

I also am looking for alternatives to toaster ovens , as I have had the misfortune of burning two of them up and the wife put her foot down and said toaster ovens are not allowed in the shop anymore ( lucky I did not burn the house down or do more damage than I did ) so ideas please


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## Trob115 (Apr 25, 2022)

Turnedaround said:


> I also am looking for alternatives to toaster ovens , as I have had the misfortune of burning two of them up and the wife put her foot down and said toaster ovens are not allowed in the shop anymore ( lucky I did not burn the house down or do more damage than I did ) so ideas please


Get you an old upright freezer and make a small kiln. It's really easy to make and you can dry a lot of material quickly. I made one last year and my heat source is just a single 60w bulb.

you could add a heat lamp and easily reach 200 degrees.


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## Turnedaround (Apr 25, 2022)

Trob115 said:


> Get you an old upright freezer and make a small kiln. It's really easy to make and you can dry a lot of material quickly. I made one last year and my heat source is just a single 60w bulb.


How long does it take to dry things out ? And to what temp can you get to with just one bulb? I should look it up but your response intrigues me


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## Trob115 (Apr 25, 2022)

Turnedaround said:


> How long does it take to dry things out ? And to what temp can you get to with just one bulb? I should look it up but your response intrigues me


I can easily hit 115 with 1 bulb and it's a 27 cubic foot freezer. I have a thermostat wired to a bathroom vent fan to regulate the temp.

and I can dry 9" bowl blanks in about 3 weeks.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Turnedaround (Apr 25, 2022)

Trob115 said:


> I can easily hit 115 with 1 bulb and it's a 27 cubic foot freezer. I have a thermostat wired to a bathroom vent fan to regulate the temp.
> 
> and I can dry 9" bowl blanks in about 3 weeks.


youtube is an amazing thing to find answers , some of those freezer kilns are pretty neat


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## Trob115 (Apr 26, 2022)

Turnedaround said:


> youtube is an amazing thing to find answers , some of those freezer kilns are pretty neat

Reactions: Like 1 | EyeCandy! 1 | Way Cool 1 | Creative 1


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## Greenacres2 (Apr 26, 2022)

Turnedaround said:


> I also am looking for alternatives to toaster ovens , as I have had the misfortune of burning two of them up and the wife put her foot down and said toaster ovens are not allowed in the shop anymore ( lucky I did not burn the house down or do more damage than I did ) so ideas please


I tried using a PID to control a toaster oven. To hold at 190 F, i had to set the PID to 156, and then the oven would power off--temp would still rise to above 350 F after the heating element turned off. Lived with that until i found 6 buckeye burl blanks burnt to ashes--fortunately the garage survived. No more toaster ovens in our house ever--not even to use as a toaster oven!!

I bought a small lab vacuum oven on the auction site--high mass and really stable, probably less amp draw than a 100 watt incandescent bulb. At some some point, i'll upgrade to a dental lab oven without the vacuum seal for curing. Could then relegate the vacuum oven to just being an extra vac chamber. When i put pen blanks in to dry before C J, i'll pull a vacuum while the oven is heating. Normal boiling point of water at sea level is 212 F, but with 29" of vacuum that drops to under 75 F if i recall correctly. So that initial vacuum speeds the drying process. I make sure to isolate the chamber before it gets warm, as i don't want the moisture in my vac pump. 

The used medical/dental ovens can be bought relatively cheap, but shipping is tough due to weight--so location near you will be helpful.
In answer to someone's question about how long it takes to cure Cactus Juice--that 185 F only needs to be maintained for about 10 minutes to catalyze--but that's 10 minutes at the core of the wood. If that cycle is disrupted, the C J will not cure ever. When i cure a batch, i usually go 4-6 hours in that small oven--just to make sure they're done!! (put them in to start in the morning, go to work and take them out at lunch.)

Good luck!!
earl

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Mike Hill (Apr 26, 2022)

Yep, I obtained a used lab oven for use as a smoker - I was going to add a smoke generator. But then I had dreams of all the stuff that might have grow in it and gave up that idea. I'll have to get it down from the attic and repurpose it as a wood dryer outer! I don't remember the controls it had, but I have a couple of PID's off of various smoker from the past. I used to build hospitals and stuff like that wasn't hard for me to obtain. Even had a sterilizer at one time - that was kinda fun but heavy. Only thing I wanted, but could not get was one of the ceiling hung exam lights. Man I wanted one at one time! My flexible shaft machine holder had a first life as an IV stand.

Reactions: Like 2


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## Turnedaround (Apr 26, 2022)

Greenacres2 said:


> I tried using a PID to control a toaster oven. To hold at 190 F, i had to set the PID to 156, and then the oven would power off--temp would still rise to above 350 F after the heating element turned off. Lived with that until i found 6 buckeye burl blanks burnt to ashes--fortunately the garage survived. No more toaster ovens in our house ever--not even to use as a toaster oven!!
> 
> I bought a small lab vacuum oven on the auction site--high mass and really stable, probably less amp draw than a 100 watt incandescent bulb. At some some point, i'll upgrade to a dental lab oven without the vacuum seal for curing. Could then relegate the vacuum oven to just being an extra vac chamber. When i put pen blanks in to dry before C J, i'll pull a vacuum while the oven is heating. Normal boiling point of water at sea level is 212 F, but with 29" of vacuum that drops to under 75 F if i recall correctly. So that initial vacuum speeds the drying process. I make sure to isolate the chamber before it gets warm, as i don't want the moisture in my vac pump.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this informative reply I now have a new mission while at work tonight I will contact you again if that ok as I have questions.


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## Turnedaround (Apr 26, 2022)

Mike Hill said:


> Yep, I obtained a used lab oven for use as a smoker - I was going to add a smoke generator. But then I had dreams of all the stuff that might have grow in it and gave up that idea. I'll have to get it down from the attic and repurpose it as a wood dryer outer! I don't remember the controls it had, but I have a couple of PID's off of various smoker from the past. I used to build hospitals and stuff like that wasn't hard for me to obtain. Even had a sterilizer at one time - that was kinda fun but heavy. Only thing I wanted, but could not get was one of the ceiling hung exam lights. Man I wanted one at one time! My flexible shaft machine holder had a first life as an IV stand.


You must have some good stories about the things you acquired


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## Turnedaround (Apr 26, 2022)

Trob115 said:


> View attachment 226084
> 
> View attachment 226085
> 
> View attachment 226086


So what size of hole on the bottom ? I’m guessing 2 inch


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## Trob115 (Apr 26, 2022)

Turnedaround said:


> So what size of hole on the bottom ? I’m guessing 2 inch


Yep exactly.


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## Greenacres2 (Apr 27, 2022)

Man, i saw @Trob115 freezer-kiln yesterday afternoon and lost a solid hour of work time watching video. There's a small used appliance dealer here, i'm guessing he'd be happy to get rid of a carcass!! My garage is unheated (and un air conditioned) and we can get below zero F in the winter--you think a 60-100 watt bulb might keep up once we get rolling in the winter??


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## Trob115 (Apr 27, 2022)

Greenacres2 said:


> Man, i saw @Trob115 freezer-kiln yesterday afternoon and lost a solid hour of work time watching video. There's a small used appliance dealer here, i'm guessing he'd be happy to get rid of a carcass!! My garage is unheated (and un air conditioned) and we can get below zero F in the winter--you think a 60-100 watt bulb might keep up once we get rolling in the winter??


If it were me, I would add you a second light receptacle in there and then I think it would definitely keep up. You could always just run 1 bulb during the summer. My kiln is in an insulated building so I don't have huge temperature gradients. Another option would be to put a small heat lamp inside, and that would work as a stand alone heat source.


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