# Jet 1221 VS unboxing and initial impressions and why I didn't buy the Rikon



## Schroedc (Sep 4, 2016)

Got back from the Twin Cities about 8:45, dropped my wife and kids at the house and ran to the shop to unload the new lathe. She messaged me she was going to bed so I decided to open the box to take a look and of course one thing led to another and.....

First some background. For anyone living under a rock the last two days, My Delta 46-460 Variable Speed Midi lathe is becoming problematic and since out of warranty and I turn lots of pens for a living I needed to replace it in a hurry with something reliable. Got lots of great input on here, read a lot of reviews and went to Woodcraft to buy a new lathe. Hadn't made up my mind when I walked in yet so plugged in both demo units and started screwing around with them. 

First the Rikon, I did like the 1" tool rest post, the VS was smooth, didn't have the soft start. That was about the limits of what impressed me. For a right out of the box unit (They'd just unboxed it and put on a stand, no dial in or tweaking) It was disappointing, the pulley was loose on the headstock shaft, things didn't quite line up really well and a lot of parts were identical to the Delta, like they'd just ordered the same parts and then used their own casting to mount them, tailstock was lighter than I'd like and a bit sloppy IMO compared to the Delta I had and the Jet. I suppose we could have opened up another and seen if any different but initial impression put me off a bit. the other thing I didn't care for was the bed was ligher than the Jet, and 1/2 way down narrows up, wouldn't really be an issue but if I was doing a longer spindle, down towards the far end you'd have less clamping area for the banjo.

The Jet demo unit was about 2 years old, was actually one of their classroom units and had been used and abused. Even with that, The tailstock was tight, things moved smoothly and everything felt beefy and well built. They were willing to give me the sale price that starts in a week so I decided to spend the money on it. 

The Jet 1221 has gone to a 5 year warranty just like the Rikon and their customer service is at least decent if not quite stellar. Also, all my tool rests and other accessories fit so I don't have the expense of buying a couple new tool rests or modifying ones I have. The Jet is also about 30 pounds heavier than the Rikon and my old Delta (Holy crap was it hard to get up on the bench by myself)

Opened the box and the acessories are pretty decent, rubber coated handles on the faceplate wrench and the knock out rod (I prefer a heavier rod but so far it does seem to work fine, we'll see how I like it long term) They also give you a tool holder for both ends of the machine (The left one is already installed out of the box, you have to install the right one but just two allen bolts) It does come with both a 6 and 12 inch tool rest, They are decent but I really like my aftermarket rest with the hardened rounded rod on top so I'll throw the new ones on the shelf.



 



 

Everything is well greased/oiled. no corrosion issues (I've occasionally bought new equipment I've had to polish right out of the box)



 

Got it up on the bench, wiped down all the oil. Includes a 3 inch faceplate and decent drive and live centers. I have a few I'm partial to and most of what I do is using a big cone center and a dead center so into the drawer until I need them for spindles or whatnot. Here is so far the only thing I don't like, Instead of wings on the ends to bolt through it has mounting holes up from the bottom. Instead of screwing it down form the top like I've always done I'll have to drill through the bench and bolt from the bottom but I can live with that. Head and tail lined up dead on right out of the box, also checked with a mandrel to make sure they were parallel as you moved further out, still right on at 12 inches out from the headstock.



 

Of course since I'd gotten that far and had a Mesa tubed and ready to go I figured I'd break it in a bit. Runs much quieter than my old Delta and a bit quieter than the Rikon. Possibly due to the added mass absorbing any vibration.... It will take some getting used to the power switch down in front on the right, I've been so used to top left for power and speed but it would have been the same with the Rikon. 



 



 

I do like the wider range of speed in each band, I can go both higher and lower than the Delta or the Rikon without belt change. It'll take a bit to get used to it so I can dial it in by ear as I turn and sand but once I repeat a few dozen times I should be comfortable. We'll see how the bed does with having water dripped on it while wet sanding, The Delta and my earlier Excelsior of course oxidized even with regular wipe down and oiling so I don't expect anything different here but the jump in cost to something with Stainless ways like a Oneway 1224 isn't in the cards right now.

All in all I'm happy with the machine at least in the first 10 minutes I ran it, I'll update after a hundred or so pens have been turned on it, So probably Wednesday or so.

Reactions: Like 5 | Way Cool 7 | Informative 2 | Useful 2


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## ripjack13 (Sep 4, 2016)

Nice. How about waxing the bed? I do it to my rikon and have no rust.

Reactions: Agree 3


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## Schroedc (Sep 4, 2016)

ripjack13 said:


> Nice. How about waxing the bed? I do it to my rikon and have no rust.



Yes, I regularly wax the ways but over time it happens. I'll probably be more diligent with this one for a while since it is brand new.

Reactions: Like 1 | Creative 1


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## ripjack13 (Sep 4, 2016)

Wax on...wax off....

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Tclem (Sep 4, 2016)

You got this because I have it and you want to be like me. Admit it

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Schroedc (Sep 4, 2016)

Tclem said:


> You got this because I have it and you want to be like me. Admit it



I'd have to get rid of more hair and loose more teeth and put a car on blocks in the yard if I wanted to do that

Reactions: Great Post 1 | Funny 10


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## Mike1950 (Sep 4, 2016)

and buy a chamber pot for headgear

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2


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## Schroedc (Sep 4, 2016)

Also- The thread collar I put on the headstock, That's something I had off a Rockwell lathe from the 60's, works great to protect the threads when yo don't have a face plate or chuck installed, also help to keep from cutting up your hand if you slip or catching your steel wool or rag while polishing and wrapping it around the work piece. If a guy can find one, I recommend using one!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Tclem (Sep 4, 2016)

Schroedc said:


> I'd have to get rid of more hair and loose more teeth and put a car on blocks in the yard if I wanted to do that


I do have all my teeth. Lol


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## Sprung (Sep 4, 2016)

Very nice, Colin! And thank you for the thorough initial thoughts and review. I'll be looking forward to hearing how you like it after you've spent more time with it. I'll probably have to spend some time checking it out next time I'm at your shop. I'm thinking that, eventually, this will be my new lathe...


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## Tclem (Sep 4, 2016)

Mike1950 said:


> and buy a chamber pot for headgear


I do t need a walker

Reactions: Funny 3


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## duncsuss (Sep 4, 2016)

Schroedc said:


> Yes, I regularly wax the ways but over time it happens. I'll probably be more diligent with this one for a while since it is brand new.



I started using these ... LINK ... place and remove quickly, easy to store (against the side of my metal filing cabinet where I keep sandpaper, etc.)


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## Mike1950 (Sep 4, 2016)

Tclem said:


> I do t need a walker



Sorry you need a walker....... I can see why Henry has to keep an eye on yer spelin....

Reactions: Funny 2


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## deltatango (Sep 4, 2016)

Thanks for the photos asnd the review - looks like a good heavy lathe. Hope you get used to it soon and back in the saddle. Nice that you were able to pick it up relatively close by.
How much was it?


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## ripjack13 (Sep 4, 2016)

Tclem said:


> I do have all my teeth. Lol


In a jar.....

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Tclem (Sep 4, 2016)

Mike1950 said:


> Sorry you need a walker....... I can see why Henry has to keep an eye on yer spelin....


That's kinda like I do and I don't


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## Schroedc (Sep 4, 2016)

deltatango said:


> Thanks for the photos asnd the review - looks like a good heavy lathe. Hope you get used to it soon and back in the saddle. Nice that you were able to pick it up relatively close by.
> How much was it?



720 on sale.

Reactions: Like 2


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## CWS (Sep 5, 2016)

I use the Sunday newspaper when I wet sand.

Reactions: Like 1


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## woodtickgreg (Sep 5, 2016)

Very interesting comparison Colin. Glad you got a new lathe that suits your needs. I did like a lot of things on the Jet when I was looking and comparing them side by side. I loved the bed on the Jet. I think for me in the end it was the 1" tool post and the cost that sold me on the Rikon. I grabbed it on an introductory sale and it was like $549 or something? Quiet a bit cheaper than the jet. But as I said earlier, interesting to see what a pro deams as important verses a hobby turner. You made good intelligent choices to suit your needs. Also good to know that jet has stepped up their warranty too!
I will say this, the lathes I looked at in my local wood craft where tight and right! Side by side to make good comparisons. There was nothing I saw on either one that said they where put together wrong or cheaply built. Not good that you got a bad impression on that. But I am very happy that you got a great lathe that you are happy with, either one would be a great choice for any turner I think.


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## Schroedc (Sep 5, 2016)

woodtickgreg said:


> Very interesting comparison Colin. Glad you got a new lathe that suits your needs. I did like a lot of things on the Jet when I was looking and comparing them side by side. I loved the bed on the Jet. I think for me in the end it was the 1" tool post and the cost that sold me on the Rikon. I grabbed it on an introductory sale and it was like $549 or something? Quiet a bit cheaper than the jet. But as I said earlier, interesting to see what a pro deams as important verses a hobby turner. You made good intelligent choices to suit your needs. Also good to know that jet has stepped up their warranty too!
> I will say this, the lathes I looked at in my local wood craft where tight and right! Side by side to make good comparisons. There was nothing I saw on either one that said they where put together wrong or cheaply built. Not good that you got a bad impression on that. But I am very happy that you got a great lathe that you are happy with, either one would be a great choice for any turner I think.



Yeah, I would have dialed the Rikon in right out of the box to present the best impression to the customer but I don't know how long it had been set up, possibly just out of the box so no time but IMO It should have set in the back until tweaked. Currently the regular price on the Rikon is around 649.00. What with them willing to give me the upcoming sale price on the Jet it was only a 70.00 difference so I put cost aside. If the difference had been a couple hundred I might have thought differently but...

I've been running it about 1 1/2 hours already this morning, put the first scratch on it (Banged it with a tool and scratched the paint ) I'm still trying to get used to the switch and controls on the right. After 5 years I'd gotten to the point I didn't even have to look on the Delta. Used to keeping the tool in the right hand while dialing and switching with the left. Starting to tuck the tool into my left armpit to run the controls.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ray D (Sep 7, 2016)

Great review. I am definitely a fan of Jet products...I own three.


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## Schroedc (Sep 7, 2016)

Thought I'd give some thoughts now that I've put a few days use on the machine, Have turned about 150 pens on it in the last 3 days (Most single tubes) and I really like it

Soft start- It's fast enough, really not slowing me down, I flip it on, by the time I pick up my tool, get in position to start cutting it's up to speed.

VS- The range is great, I can get slower and faster in the same belt position than I could on the Delta and based on the literature the Rikon. It's making for easier sanding with being able to get really slow for oily woods and acrylics that would normally heat up and load your paper.

Mass- This thing is a beast. Much heavier than my old lathe, and form the literature about 30 pounds heavier than the Rikon. it doesn't move on the bench at all. I still haven't bolted it down but it hasn't walked at all.

General fit and finish- Everything moves smoothly, things are tight, no play in the tailstock even without tightening the quill lock. the Banjo and talistock lock down tight without having to reef on the handle. tool rest clamp works fine, no sliding down as I turn even when getting aggressive with cutting.

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## Mr.GfCs (Oct 17, 2016)

Schroedc, I actually joined this forum because of this thread. I got confirmation today that my Jet 1221 with the Nova G3 and 16 gouges was shipped today.
Q: can you tell if the lock on the tail-stock can be reveres to be on the other side?

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Schroedc (Oct 17, 2016)

Mr.GfCs said:


> Schroedc, I actually joined this forum because of this thread. I got confirmation today that my Jet 1221 with the Nova G3 and 16 gouges was shipped today.
> Q: can you tell if the lock on the tail-stock can be reveres to be on the other side?



Like you want the lock lever for the tailsstock on the front? If so I can't see why not, remove the dammit clip, pull the handle out and reverse and reinstall.

If you're talking about the quill lock, that lever is adjustable to wherever you want it but has to stay on the back side

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## Schroedc (Sep 19, 2017)

Thanks @Sprung for bringing this one back to the front of my mind- Time for a one year review!

I've beaten the heck out of it. Probably 4500 items or so turned on it in the last year. It's grimy, dirty, and in need of a bath but I have not had a single issue with it yet. Only a couple observations- Starting to see a tiny bit of wear in the tailstock quill, not really slop, just getting a bit loser for cranking in and out but as I turn most between centers it gets run in and out quite a bit. The VS knob- It started to get loose, just pulled the knob, tightened the lock nut back down and no issue. Otherwise I'm still on the original belt, motor isn't making any noise and headstock bearings are still tight and quiet.

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## Smitty (Sep 19, 2017)

Thanks, Colin. I like update posts. It is nice to hear how a lathe is holding up after time. It is a factor in my buying decisions. Like I indicated in another thread, I am now looking with some interest at a Nova Comet which is more within my budget. I wish there were more update posts on the web concerning the Comet.


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## rocky1 (Sep 19, 2017)

Not sure if you've been lurking, or just arrived altogether, but Colin's year on that lathe is probably the equivalent of most folks 5 years, or more, on a lathe Dan.

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## Sprung (Sep 19, 2017)

rocky1 said:


> Not sure if you've been lurking, or just arrived altogether, but Colin's year on that lathe is probably the equivalent of most folks 5 years, or more, on a lathe Dan.



I was thinking more along the lines of the lifetime of their owning/using the lathe for probably most guys, lol.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1


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## Schroedc (Sep 19, 2017)

Sprung said:


> I was thinking more along the lines of the lifetime of their owning/using the lathe for probably most guys, lol.



And I've got another 600-700 pieces to turn on it on the next 10 days or so.

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## Sprung (Sep 19, 2017)

Schroedc said:


> And I've got another 600-700 pieces to turn on it on the next 10 days or so.



From your posts lately, it seems like the lathe has spent more time spinning than it has turned off.

Reactions: Agree 3 | Funny 1


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## TimR (Sep 20, 2017)

Great follow up @Schroedc , I did some demos on that lathe for our local WC when they first came out and was similarly impressed. When (hopefully only if) my Delta dies I'd likely make same choice on the Jet. Would be nice to adjust the soft start, but I expect it will prevent a chuck from unwinding inadvertently or twisting a goblet shaft.


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## Sprung (Sep 20, 2017)

TimR said:


> Great follow up @Schroedc , I did some demos on that lathe for our local WC when they first came out and was similarly impressed. When (hopefully only if) my Delta dies I'd likely make same choice on the Jet. Would be nice to adjust the soft start, but I expect it will prevent a chuck from unwinding inadvertently or twisting a goblet shaft.



Tim, if I'm remembering correctly, I think I saw a brief discussion on the soft start feature here a while ago and it sounds like the newer ones, like mine, start up much quicker than the first ones did. On mine, I turn it on and about the time I've got my tool in place on the rest and my hands in position on the tool, it's up to speed and ready for me to start turning - or my wait at that point is extremely brief if I'm quicker than normal in getting the tool into position.

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## duncsuss (Sep 20, 2017)

Smitty said:


> I wish there were more update posts on the web concerning the Comet.



It's my belief that if there had been anything bad, you'd have seen *lots* of posts about it -- unhappy turners are seldom quiet  -- but it would still be nice to hear positives rather than judge by "absence of negatives".

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## duncsuss (Sep 20, 2017)

Sprung said:


> ... I think I saw a brief discussion on the soft start feature here a while ago and it sounds like the newer ones, like mine, start up much quicker than the first ones did.



Might have been me -- our club bought one of the first batch of 1221vs lathes, and the soft-start takes way longer than necessary to ramp up to speed.


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## Schroedc (Sep 20, 2017)

duncsuss said:


> Might have been me -- our club bought one of the first batch of 1221vs lathes, and the soft-start takes way longer than necessary to ramp up to speed.



Although I have to wonder if that long start contributes to longer bearing and motor life. The second 1221vs I bought is older, has a really quick ramp up compared to mine and did need bearings when I bought it although it had been used in an unheated garage so possible was started cold at some point.


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## duncsuss (Sep 20, 2017)

Schroedc said:


> Although I have to wonder if that long start contributes to longer bearing and motor life. The second 1221vs I bought is older, has a really quick ramp up compared to mine and did need bearings when I bought it although it had been used in an unheated garage so possible was started cold at some point.


I can't think of a mechanical reason why a shorter ramp-up it would affect the bearings; it requires more torque and places greater stress on the shaft, but I'm not seeing the link from those things to bearings. A more likely explanation for bearing failure IMO would be if out-of-balance pieces were spun at high revs.

Shorter motor life is quite possible: hard starts are often accompanied by current surges through the windings, which could affect control circuitry even if it doesn't cause the copper to burn out.


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## Smitty (Sep 20, 2017)

duncsuss said:


> It's my belief that if there had been anything bad, you'd have seen *lots* of posts about it -- unhappy turners are seldom quiet  -- but it would still be nice to hear positives rather than judge by "absence of negatives".



I hope you are correct. I did start a new thread last night on the Comet II (after responding to this thread), and only have had one response so far. It is a good and postive response. Maybe the Comet II is just not too popular on this forum.


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## Schroedc (Sep 20, 2017)

Smitty said:


> I hope you are correct. I did start a new thread last night on the Comet II (after responding to this thread), and only have had one response so far. It is a good and postive response. Maybe the Comet II is just not too popular on this forum.



Give it a little time, I don't recall seeing a lot of folks with them yet but there might be some out there. I do know we have some owners with the big Nova lathes and nothing but good things to say about them.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## CWS (Sep 20, 2017)

Schroedc said:


> And I've got another 600-700 pieces to turn on it on the next 10 days or so.


That's a walk in the park for you. It is only 60 or 70 a day.


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## Sprung (Sep 20, 2017)

CWS said:


> That's a walk in the park for you. It is only 60 or 70 a day.



If he only does 60-70 each day, what's he going to do after breakfast?

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2


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## CWS (Sep 20, 2017)

Sprung said:


> If he only does 60-70 each day, what's he going to do after breakfast?


Never though of that.


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## Schroedc (Sep 20, 2017)

In the interests of full disclosure, Today I was working along and the bearings gave out on my live center, since I had to run to town 20 miles away for bearings I figured I'd check several machines to see what was in them to have spares on hand, found something interesting, appears the dust seal failed on one of the bearings in the Jet, there was grease all over the inside. It's less than 10.00 for a set of bearings so I changed them out. Even with the loss of grease it was still tight and no noise. Talked a bit with the guys where I get my bearings and they asked what my most typical RPM was and I said 2700-3200 RPM, he was surprised they lasted this long as much as I turn. They are a service center for several different brands and he said that the bearings all of them are using weren't really meant for sustained high RPM's and he says the ones he sees in for head stock bearings are all pen turners.... So if you do turn a high volume of pens, Bearings are probably going to be a wear item for you eventually no matter what lathe you use.

Reactions: Informative 2


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## rocky1 (Sep 20, 2017)

That's interesting... You would think the stresses of heavy off balanced loads would be worse on it. But, that doesn't generate the heat high RPMs do.


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## Schroedc (Sep 20, 2017)

rocky1 said:


> That's interesting... You would think the stresses of heavy off balanced loads would be worse on it. But, that doesn't generate the heat high RPMs do.



Yeah, he said what usually happens is they run hot, blow the grease and then wear out. The bearing at the back of the shaft was fine.


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## Schroedc (Sep 20, 2017)

And again- to anyone reading this, My lathe does not get what you'd call typical use. Other than to switch out blanks it was running for about 6 1/2 hours non stop today at rpms between 1,300 and 3,000.

Reactions: Informative 1


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