# Turning tool recommendations?



## scootac (Sep 19, 2022)

Yeah.....being that guy.
Have a set of carbide tools, but want to start buying some 'normal' tools. Lathe is a Jet 1221 for an idea of what size I can turn. Mostly interested in turning bowls.
I see people saying Benjamins Best are a good value, I see guys saying you get what you pay for. I believe in buying quality once vs paying over and over.
Bens Best, Sorby, Crown, Taylor, Hurricane.....sooo many choices!!! Sets vs individual pcs??? What are considered essentials?
Help!!!!

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## William Tanner (Sep 19, 2022)

Years ago I picked up a set of Hamlet gouges from a gent who had to quit turning due to wood allergies. I have many tools of different manufacturers but I lIke the Hamlet tools the best. Those always end up in my hand. I like the wood handles and the balance of them. I have continued to purchase them from Craft Supplies USA. This company has provided me with fast service.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Informative 1


----------



## trc65 (Sep 19, 2022)

While you are learning to turn bowls and sharpening techniques/styles, I have no problem starting out with some inexpensive tools like BB. I started with them nearly 5 years ago and still use some today. I also have a few "premium" gouges from Thompson Tools and D-way. When you are figuring out how to sharpen, it doesn't hurt as much to practice/screw up with a $25 gouge as it does with a $90 gouge.

I have a Rikon lathe with a 12.5" swing so I'm similar in size to your lathe. Even though I mostly use a 5/8" gouge, I'd recommend you start out with the 1/2" size and decide after turning a few dozen bowls if you want to go bigger. I'd suggest two gouges, one with a simple fingernail grind and another with a steeper "bottom of bowl" grind. 

I'm an advocate of buying just a couple of tools vs buying sets.

Do you have a sharpening setup yet?

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 2 | Useful 1


----------



## scootac (Sep 19, 2022)

trc65 said:


> While you are learning to turn bowls and sharpening techniques/styles, I have no problem starting out with some inexpensive tools like BB. I started with them nearly 5 years ago and still use some today. I also have a few "premium" gouges from Thompson Tools and D-way. When you are figuring out how to sharpen, it doesn't hurt as much to practice/screw up with a $25 gouge as it does with a $90 gouge.
> 
> I have a Rikon lathe with a 12.5" swing so I'm similar in size to your lathe. Even though I mostly use a 5/8" gouge, I'd recommend you start out with the 1/2" size and decide after turning a few dozen bowls if you want to go bigger. I'd suggest two gouges, one with a simple fingernail grind and another with a steeper "bottom of bowl" grind.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the comments!
I do have a very old set that was Dad's. Got a grinder and Wolvering jig so getting familiar with the sharpening process. 
Unless I hear some real bad experiences, probably leaning to giving a couple BB tools a shot.


----------



## William Tanner (Sep 19, 2022)

trc65 said:


> While you are learning to turn bowls and sharpening techniques/styles, I have no problem starting out with some inexpensive tools like BB. I started with them nearly 5 years ago and still use some today. I also have a few "premium" gouges from Thompson Tools and D-way. When you are figuring out how to sharpen, it doesn't hurt as much to practice/screw up with a $25 gouge as it does with a $90 gouge.
> 
> I have a Rikon lathe with a 12.5" swing so I'm similar in size to your lathe. Even though I mostly use a 5/8" gouge, I'd recommend you start out with the 1/2" size and decide after turning a few dozen bowls if you want to go bigger. I'd suggest two gouges, one with a simple fingernail grind and another with a steeper "bottom of bowl" grind.
> 
> ...


Totally agree on the 1/2” size. I mainly use two 1/2” Hamlet bowl gouges. Each has a different grind.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1 | Useful 1


----------



## trc65 (Sep 19, 2022)

A comment on sharpening. Pick a setup and focus on repeatability, not on all the variations you can grind. Focus on tool presentation, control and muscle memory. When you get to the point you can turn a bowl without thinking about it, you'll be ready to evaluate your style vs other grinds that may make you more efficient.

If you are looking for a starting point, take a look at this page at Thompson Tools. It's a good basic setup that will work and what I've used since I started. https://thompsonlathetools.com/sharpening/

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Informative 1


----------



## Fsyxxx (Sep 19, 2022)

MADE BY A WOODTURNER FOR WOODTURNERS! - Thompson Lathe Tools







thompsonlathetools.com





This guy makes the best imo. Grab 3/8 bowl gouge and you’ll never look back. Doesn’t hurt his a good guy too.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Informative 1 | Useful 1


----------



## William Tanner (Sep 19, 2022)

Another point that is often made here is to join a turning club. AAW lists ten clubs in your state. Maybe you are already a member. It is huge to have experience at your side, especially when you try to get the feel of how to sharpen or how to make different cuts. As a former president and VP of one of my clubs, I often fielded emails and phone calls from those who wanted to learn how to turn. We always suggested new folks not to buy until they spent at the club. So many people buy wrong. I like the fact that you are transitioning to traditional tools. A bit of a learning curve but you can do so much more with them. Good decision there.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1 | Agree 2


----------



## scootac (Sep 20, 2022)

William Tanner said:


> Another point that is often made here is to join a turning club. AAW lists ten clubs in your state. Maybe you are already a member. It is huge to have experience at your side, especially when you try to get the feel of how to sharpen or how to make different cuts. As a former president and VP of one of my clubs, I often fielded emails and phone calls from those who wanted to learn how to turn. We always suggested new folks not to buy until they spent at the club. So many people buy wrong. I like the fact that you are transitioning to traditional tools. A bit of a learning curve but you can do so much more with them. Good decision there.


Thanks for your comments!
I did join a turning club about 4 yrs ago, and took hands-on classes they offered. The class was very good.....personal instruction, made several projects. The meetings were a bit much for me as a raw beginner though. Guys would demonstrate very advanced techniques while I was looking for simple basics. The class helped with that shortcoming. Very strong opinions on carbide vs traditional tools didn't help a beginner either.
Then.....covid.....and the meetings stopped. I bought my lathe, set of carbide tools......and found youtube videos to help me along. Not maybe the best way....but I've made some nice bowls and even sold some turkey calls. All with carbide tools. 
Retired with time on my hands, plenty of wood to use, and sometimes finding one's own way is very satisfying.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1 | +Karma 1


----------



## Fsyxxx (Sep 20, 2022)

Carbide tools have a place in a turning studio, I use traditional tools primarily but there are times I reach for the others. I know some guys that only use carbide and turn out (ha,ha) some really nice work. That being said I find it more enjoyable to ride the bevel on a good gouge than to scrape with carbide. Learn both! The hardest thing about traditional tools is the sharpening after that it’s just fun.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1


----------



## scootac (Sep 20, 2022)

Fsyxxx said:


> .......The hardest thing about traditional tools is the sharpening after that it’s just fun.


Biggest reason I started with carbide tools! 
I wanted to learn to TURN....not learn to sharpen.

Reactions: Like 4


----------



## Gdurfey (Sep 20, 2022)

Fsyxxx said:


> Carbide tools have a place in a turning studio, I use traditional tools primarily but there are times I reach for the others. I know some guys that only use carbide and turn out (ha,ha) some really nice work. That being said I find it more enjoyable to ride the bevel on a good gouge than to scrape with carbide. Learn both! The hardest thing about traditional tools is the sharpening after that it’s just fun.


you said it. I have both and when I get "stuck" I definitely can do a touch up with a carbide. But when I finally get that bevel going (not often) it just feels great and you truly cut down on your sanding. Then again, I go a little deep and have to start back at the lip and go again.....trial and error.

Understand about the club issue. Ours seemed very unfriendly/cliquish.....they are great folks...after 5 years. But there were several that stepped up and talked with us new guys.

As for grinding, I think woodturnerscatalog site has some info on setting up the Wolverine Jig. I have it and Tim is correct, repeatability is the key. Everyone has suggestions on different angles and such. you will learn from the feel that it is sharp!!!

I have a mix of tools; mostly from Woodcraft. I have some of their brand as well as Sorby. Still figuring out which bowl gouge and grind I have the best success with!!!

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1


----------



## Fsyxxx (Sep 20, 2022)

If you decide to grab a Thompson gouge follow the directions that come with it. It’ll give you best success imo.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1


----------



## William Tanner (Sep 20, 2022)

Lots of really good points being made here. Covid really disrupted all clubs and really hurt the turners who were just starting to learn. I remember my first meeting and it was intimidating I’ll give you that. It has been a tradition with our club to introduce new visitors and new members at meetings and really try to make them feel comfortable. We have several experienced turners who usually have at least one new person that they work with. I have one now and another is working with three. This is because we have mentoring program that we promote. In addition, now that we are meeting in person again, we have open turning days and also training days where new folks can sign up to learn the basics. Safety and sharpening are included. And, we also have a day where it is just the ladies. This all happens in the shop where we have our lathes, sharpening station and other club tools. It has been my experience that most wood turners are willing to help and share their knowledge. Sometimes you have to find that person you seem to connect with. Sometimes you just have to say that you would like to work with someone in the club to help you along.

Reactions: Like 1 | Great Post 2


----------



## Herb G. (Sep 20, 2022)

scootac said:


> Thanks for your comments!
> I did join a turning club about 4 yrs ago, and took hands-on classes they offered. The class was very good.....personal instruction, made several projects. The meetings were a bit much for me as a raw beginner though. Guys would demonstrate very advanced techniques while I was looking for simple basics. The class helped with that shortcoming. Very strong opinions on carbide vs traditional tools didn't help a beginner either.
> Then.....covid.....and the meetings stopped. I bought my lathe, set of carbide tools......and found youtube videos to help me along. Not maybe the best way....but I've made some nice bowls and even sold some turkey calls. All with carbide tools.
> Retired with time on my hands, plenty of wood to use, and sometimes finding one's own way is very satisfying.


I did the same thing. Except the club I joined was a bunch of old guys who sat around mostly & told war stories. I never could get anyone to help me learn to turn. All they were worried about was collecting dues & when the next club picnic was going to be.
So, I got a set of carbide tools & taught myself how to turn pens, bowls, stoppers, etc. I learned way more from YT vids than any one of those old geezers ever taught me. BTW, @jaustin on this forum makes some great carbide tools.

Reactions: Like 2


----------



## scootac (Sep 20, 2022)

I appreciate all the comments and advice that have been written, sounds like we all have had the same experiences!
But.....back to the question.....what traditional tools to buy???
Especially.....any good reason to NOT buy BB tools? Few people go in my shop, so the name on the handle doesn't need to impress anyone.


----------



## trc65 (Sep 20, 2022)

George, as I said, I started with BB tools and I'm still using some of them everytime I turn on the lathe, nearly 5 years after I bought them. They have a place right next to any tool out there. 

The only difference with the BB vs some other $$$ brands is the BB (and other inexpensive brands) will need to be sharpened more often. 

My next bowl gouge purchase will probably be a BB gouge as I want to start exploring the 40/40 freehand grind and see how it might fit my way of turning.

Reactions: Useful 1


----------



## Gdurfey (Sep 20, 2022)

As for types, and after some trial and error (and I am going off of memory as stuff is still packed away), I think I have settled on the following so far:
3 spindle gouges, you can easily start with a mid-sized (I think 3/8) then add
a 3/4 roughing gouge. Now, this is called a "spindle" gouge, but its use, size, and shape are so different it gets its own category according to a lot of folks.
3/4 skew. and I have come to appreciate the flat sided vs. rounded on one side. Again, great debate.
and then the biggest debate out there: bowl gouges. The debate is not yes or no, but the grinds. I think the "fingernail" grind is best for starting and learning. the other grind, can't even recall the name, which someone (I think maybe Tim) mentioned above for the bottom of the bowl has given me heck. And it might be that I am just not picturing it.
Lastly, if you don't have one already, a thin parting tool.

Okay, I just spent your Christmas budget, but it is amazing the projects that you will start doing and grab for a tool if you have it just because the curve is tighter, the diameter of the piece, etc. 

Something I just thought of concerning the "less" expensive tools: as you learn, you may actually learn the feel of sharpness better than I have. I think of less expensive as the "steel" won't hold that edge as long. You will sharpen more often. Okay, once you have the set up on your wolverine and such, that isn't really that big of a deal (in my opinion). What you will get is a better feel of when you have touched it up correctly, how it feels cutting through wood like butter, and then suddenly realizing you need to touch it up again. Depending on project size, could be a couple of times during a large bowl, or 4 or 5 of Tim's penguins!!! 

Gee, please someone, chime in if I am misleading George. Just trying to address my learning curve.


----------



## Schroedc (Sep 20, 2022)

I have found pretty much anything with halfway decent HSS will get the job done, I have a few BB tools in my shop and they work fine, biggest thing to remember is sharpening, don't get them hot or you will wreck the temper and have to sharpen more often. My favorites are several Sorby tools I have but that may be just because that's what I started with and have had no complaints. Just remember, if you're going to do bowls, DO NOT get/use a spindle gouge for that, good way to snap off a gouge and get hurt. 

Heck, I have even used modified bench chisels and old screwdrivers to make specialty tools for details

Reactions: Great Post 1


----------



## GlynnC (Sep 20, 2022)

I'm too much of a newbie to offered advice backed by experience, but I will say that I started by making my own carbide tools - they were crude, but a good way to learn about the tool, then I bought several Simple carbide tools. Next I got the Sorby set of HSS tools, and have since grown to get a couple of D-Way tools. I agree with the idea of starting simple / low cost and learn the tool, then move to the better tools when you can afford it. I also agree that the pedigree name tools are worth the expense - they stay sharper and just feel better in your hands. When I see pictures of the shops of some of the veterans on this site - it appears they have built a nice collection over the years. I hope to do the same and suspect most turners will build a collection as they experiment and learn.

I don't think I've seen anyone comment yet on getting CBN wheels for your grinder. I grew up using standard stone grinding wheels, and when I learned about CBN wheels a year ago it was like a revelation. So many advantages - well worth the investment. Best wishes.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 2


----------



## scootac (Sep 20, 2022)

Most of what I'm reading re: BB tools centers around them needing sharpening more often. My grinder is ~18' from my lathe, and I need a break from standing in one spot after awhile. I don't think 'more often' sharpening is a deal killer. As I said, it's not production work, I have no deadlines, it's for enjoyment!
I know sharpening will be a learning process, hopefully I get 'the feel' without too much trouble. 
Glynn- regular grinding wheels, no CBN. Let me get over one hurdle at a time. :-)
Sooo many facets, sooo many choices!

Thanks all for the advice.....keep it coming!

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


----------



## trc65 (Sep 20, 2022)

Only other advise is beware paralysis by analysis! Pick up a tool or two and have at it. You can get tips and ideas by watching and reading, but nothing substitutes for time at the lathe. Have fun!

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 2


----------



## Fsyxxx (Sep 20, 2022)

I second the cbn wheel for sure. I think a 3:8 bowl gouge is the tool I pick up most often ( with a fingernail grind ). I have both less expensive and more expensive tools and I find the extra money I spend goes a long way in the enjoyment I get turning. It isn’t a big deal to go sharpen more often but most folks don’t. They turn with a tool that isn’t dull but isn’t really sharp anymore. I do it and my sharpening station is less than 3 feet from the lathe. The extra few minutes may not seem like much but stopping to sharpen at certain points during a shaping session can really ruin the flow. Just my .02$.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


----------



## GlynnC (Sep 21, 2022)

Fsyxxx said:


> I second the cbn wheel for sure. I think a 3:8 bowl gouge is the tool I pick up most often ( with a fingernail grind ). I have both less expensive and more expensive tools and I find the extra money I spend goes a long way in the enjoyment I get turning. It isn’t a big deal to go sharpen more often but most folks don’t. They turn with a tool that isn’t dull but isn’t really sharp anymore. I do it and my sharpening station is less than 3 feet from the lathe. The extra few minutes may not seem like much but stopping to sharpen at certain points during a shaping session can really ruin the flow. Just my .02$.


Hi Greg,
I agree with your comments about interrupting the "flow" to sharpen a tool. When everything is going smoothly and the chips are flying it just feels good and it is hard to stop. I find that I have to remember that if it feels like you need to sharpen, you probably waited too long. That's where the better steel will give you a sharp edge a little longer. And a CBN wheel sharpens quicker, with no heat, and requires no dressing, remaining perfectly flat where the tool touches the wheel. I believe the extra expense is worth it to get the maximum benefit from cheap or expensive tools.

Reactions: Useful 1


----------



## Fsyxxx (Sep 21, 2022)

GlynnC said:


> Hi Greg,
> I agree with your comments about interrupting the "flow" to sharpen a tool. When everything is going smoothly and the chips are flying it just feels good and it is hard to stop. I find that I have to remember that if it feels like you need to sharpen, you probably waited too long. That's where the better steel will give you a sharp edge a little longer. And a CBN wheel sharpens quicker, with no heat, and requires no dressing, remaining perfectly flat where the tool touches the wheel. I believe the extra expense is worth it to get the maximum benefit from cheap or expensive tools.


Absolutely, my reason for getting a cbn was once I purchased more expensive tools I didn’t want to take off so much steel every time I sharpen. I can hit the cbn and just barely take anything off. It was hurting my feelings and pocketbook to see all that lovely Thompson steel turn to dust on a regular sharpening wheel!


----------



## GlynnC (Sep 21, 2022)

Fsyxxx said:


> Absolutely, my reason for getting a cbn was once I purchased more expensive tools I didn’t want to take off so much steel every time I sharpen. I can hit the cbn and just barely take anything off. It was hurting my feelings and pocketbook to see all that lovely Thompson steel turn to dust on a regular sharpening wheel!


I agree. The CBN wheel is so quick to restore an edge. I usually just make two or three passes (very light pressure) and the tool has a new sharp edge. 
I remember reading an impressive comment once about how much wood is passing under the tool during turning. I may be remembering the math wrong, but for ease of math, let's consider that a 9 inch diameter bowl is turning 1000 rpm, that's 9,000 inches a minute, or 750 feet per minute (9000/12). If you turn for 10 minutes, that equals almost 1.5 miles (750 x 10 mins = 7,500 feet / 5280 (feet in a mile) = 1.4 miles). No wonder the tool gets dull.

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


----------



## scootac (Sep 21, 2022)

If diameter is 9".....circumference would be 28.27".
X 1000rpm.
Yeah.....cutting a lot of wood!!!

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Gdurfey (Sep 21, 2022)

never thought to do the math. Hmmmmmm. You can say your lathe needs the 10,000 mile tune up and really mean it!!!

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 2


----------



## Jonkou (Sep 22, 2022)

Some good advice already provided, two cents more… If you’re serious about and committed to the art of woodturning, don’t waste time and money with inferior bargain brands and products. Buy the tools and equipment you will use for ever up front and learn how to properly use them. Take your lead from professional turners, there’s a reason why they use the good stuff. Consider investing in your education by taking a beginner emersion course to get started and more courses as your skills develop. You will learn proper techniques and will quickly build the essential skills needed to safely and efficiently enjoy your shop time… you’ll learn more in a week at pick one, say Ellsworth’s shop, than you will in years of piecemeal efforts on your own.

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


----------



## scootac (Sep 22, 2022)

Jonkou said:


> Some good advice already provided, two cents more… If you’re serious about and committed to the art of woodturning, don’t waste time and money with inferior bargain brands and products. Buy the tools and equipment you will use for ever up front and learn how to properly use them. Take your lead from professional turners, there’s a reason why they use the good stuff. Consider investing in your education by taking a beginner emersion course to get started and more courses as your skills develop. You will learn proper techniques and will quickly build the essential skills needed to safely and efficiently enjoy your shop time… you’ll learn more in a week at pick one, say Ellsworth’s shop, than you will in years of piecemeal efforts on your own.


Thanks!
Do you have specific brands in mind on the higher end side? Seems once you go to the high end.....prices are fairly close and in a narrow range. Understandable as they have to be competitive. Imagine it comes down to grade of steel......and personal preference at that point.
If you care to suggest a brand or 2 that you think are more worthy of my $$$....I'm all ears.
Thanks!


----------



## trc65 (Sep 22, 2022)

If you are going high end, Thompson Tools and D-Way are the top of my list. I own tools from both. Different steels and flute shapes are the differences between the brands.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


----------



## Jonkou (Sep 22, 2022)

George,
You’re correct about personal preference. Used the British standard Sorby and Crown M-2 tools for many years and was happy with them. Years ago bought a D-Way M-42 bowl gouge to try and never looked back. Like the parabolic flute shape similar to Sorby and the short flute length for rigidity. Have replaced most of my front line tools with D-Way because of the manufacturing quality and superior tool steel. The British standard companies and Carter&Son have since introduced M-42 lines as well. The powdered metal Thompson (CPM10) and Glaser (CPM10/15) are quality tools too. V and U shape flutes are also available if that’s your preference.

Tool selection is like choosing the vehicle you drive, sports car to mini van, they’ll all get you there but what kind of ride do you want. Clubs are the easiest way to try a variety and decide what works best for you. Bottom line is strongly encourage you to avoid the inferior hecho in China brands.

Reactions: Agree 1


----------



## scootac (Sep 22, 2022)

Jonkou said:


> George,
> You’re correct about personal preference. Used the British standard Sorby and Crown M-2 tools for many years and was happy with them. Years ago bought a D-Way M-42 bowl gouge to try and never looked back. Like the parabolic flute shape similar to Sorby and the short flute length for rigidity. Have replaced most of my front line tools with D-Way because of the manufacturing quality and superior tool steel. The British standard companies and Carter&Son have since introduced M-42 lines as well. The powdered metal Thompson (CPM10) and Glaser (CPM10/15) are quality tools too. V and U shape flutes are also available if that’s your preference.
> 
> Tool selection is like choosing the vehicle you drive, sports car to mini van, they’ll all get you there but what kind of ride do you want. Clubs are the easiest way to try a variety and decide what works best for you. Bottom line is strongly encourage you to avoid the inferior hecho in China brands.


Thank you John!
Great info.....that sometimes is hard to get. Too many times people jump all over another's choice if it isn't their choice.....making others gun shy of expressing their opinions.
Applies to much more than turning tools!

Reactions: Agree 1 | +Karma 1


----------

