# drilling sequence for a peppermill?



## duncsuss (Apr 12, 2013)

I'm trying to get my head around the sequence of drilling/parting/gluing when making a peppermill that has a glued-in plug for the tenon (so as to preserve the grain pattern across the two parts.)

My major concern is drilling the hole for the tenon-plug if there's no solid wood for the Forstner bit point to start in -- which there will be if I drill all the way past the dividing line the way I have in the past.

I've got this far ... (for a 10" peppermill) :

* mount a 12" blank between centers
* rough to round
* at the tailstock, make a 1-3/4" diameter tenon about 1/2" deep for the tenon-plug 
* part off the tenon-plug and set aside
* make a tenon top and bottom to fit chuck jaws
* install the chuck and mount the top tenon in it
* drill into the bottom with 1-3/4" Forstner bit 5/8" deep beyond the tenon
* drill into the bottom with 1-1/16" Forstner bit as far as possible (about 3")
* drill into the bottom with 1" Forstner bit in extender rod to about 8" deep
* part off the bottom at 8-1/4", aim to leave about 1/8" cover on the previously drilled hole
* flip around and mount the bottom piece into the chuck, punch the center
* drill with 1-3/4" Forstner bit about 1/8"
* glue the tenon-plug into this hole with the center dimple exposed, put it aside to cure
* mount the top piece in the chuck again
* drill with 1-3/4" Forstner bit about 3/8"
* drill with 7/8" Forstner bit about 1/8" for drive plate
* drill through with 1/4" brad point bit for drive shaft
* maybe shape the top a bit at this point

when the glue has cured ...

* chuck the bottom piece
* drill through the plug with 1" Forstner bit (or bigger)
* chuck the top piece again
* jam the bottom piece against the top piece
* bring tailstock up snug into the hole
* turn the mill ...

Have I got this even vaguely right? Maybe I'm making it harder that it needs to be -- wouldn't be the first time!

Thanks for hanging with me ... as you can tell, I'm a bit confused


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## Kevin (Apr 12, 2013)

Didn't read all that but the way I do it is, once I part the top, I flip it around and chuck it with the narrow tenon you made for this purpose, then I install my drill chuck in the tail stock to drill a 1/2" hole roughly 1/2 - 3/4" deep and glue a 1/2" dia tenon in the mortise. I use whatever tropical hardwood or Texas dense wood like oasge/persimmon etc and I will re-chuck and shorten it once it dries in the top. You can drill drill your 1/4" hole through the top after your tenon has dried in place. Just make sure when you turned your tenon stock you made a center after you finished turning it to finished diameter and parted off to rough length....


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## duncsuss (Apr 12, 2013)

1) You put the tenon in the top? (I made mine using Mike Hawkins' guide, he has the tenon in the base.)

2) If the tenon is in the top, and is only 1/2" diameter ... where does the drive-plate go? (It's about 7/8" diameter and has the square hole to grip the shaft.)

Thanks!



Kevin said:


> Didn't read all that but the way I do it is, once I part the top, I flip it around and chuck it with the narrow tenon you made for this purpose, then I install my drill chuck in the tail stock to drill a 1/2" hole roughly 1/2 - 3/4" deep and glue a 1/2" dia tenon in the mortise. I use whatever tropical hardwood or Texas dense wood like oasge/persimmon etc and I will re-chuck and shorten it once it dries in the top. You can drill drill your 1/4" hole through the top after your tenon has dried in place. Just make sure when you turned your tenon stock you made a center after you finished turning it to finished diameter and parted off to rough length....


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## DKMD (Apr 12, 2013)

Here's how I do the shaftless version... I know it's not the same, but it may give you some idea about how to do the tenon.

http://woodbarter.com/showthread.php?tid=4475


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## duncsuss (Apr 12, 2013)

DKMD said:


> Here's how I do the shaftless version... I know it's not the same, but it may give you some idea about how to do the tenon.
> 
> http://woodbarter.com/showthread.php?tid=4475



Thanks David -- you gave me the clue I needed.

I believe the secret is to make a second chucking-tenon on the piece that is to receive the plug (in my design, the bottom -- which is the longer piece with the old-fashioned drive shaft mechanism).

That will let me drill the hole for the plug before drilling the stepped sequence of holes for the mechanism -- and I'll have solid wood to start the Forstner bits at both ends.


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## Graybeard (Apr 13, 2013)

Here is the technique I use:

http://www.woodturner.org/products/aw/peppermill.pdf

His measurement for the top in the diagram are incorrect - it should be 2 3/8th inch in diameter.

I have a DVD of him doing a demo at a club that helps understand the process. Contact me via private message if your interested and I'll make a copy and send it to you.

Graybeard


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## duncsuss (Apr 13, 2013)

Graybeard said:


> Here is the technique I use:
> 
> http://www.woodturner.org/products/aw/peppermill.pdf



Thanks! Another approach is always welcome.

However, I don't see any mention of the actual problem I'm trying to work through: using a glued-in plug of wood for the tenon between the top and the base of the mill to avoid losing a quarter-inch (or more) of grain pattern between the two parts of the mill.


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## Graybeard (Apr 13, 2013)

I've done that but have found it can be tricky to get everything to line up exactly. First the hole has to be spot on, the tenon turned and glued in straight, the 1/4 inch hole drilled straight through the tenon and top of the mill. It will definitely work and you'll only have the thickness of the parting tool between the grain pattern. I think the deeper the hole in the top of the mill, the more tenon will be glued in and the chance of it being straight are better.

In the tutorial I posted I'd drill the hole for the tenon instead of making a tenon like he does. Glue it in and drill the hole for the shaft. Then reverse, put them together and finish your pattern.

I suppose you could turn a pretty good length of material to the diameter of the hole in the mill, then cut off smaller pieces to be glued into the top of the mill. You'll want to be square and have a perfect 90 degree angle so the tenon will slide into the mill bottom without a wobble.

Hope that helps some.

Graybeard


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## Kevin (Apr 13, 2013)

duncsuss said:


> Graybeard said:
> 
> 
> > Here is the technique I use:
> ...



I probably did a poor job of explaining it but my method does address this. I'll turn a PM today or tomorrow and get some pics.


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## duncsuss (Apr 13, 2013)

Kevin said:


> duncsuss said:
> 
> 
> > Graybeard said:
> ...



Thanks Kevin -- I think David's guide gave me the clues I need, so don't feel pressured to do it.

I was told a few years ago: "Don't believe everything you think, Duncan" -- so if you can explain it to me again it'll most likely help


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## duncsuss (Apr 13, 2013)

Graybeard said:


> I think the deeper the hole in the top of the mill, the more tenon will be glued in and the chance of it being straight are better.



Thanks again!

I'm not a fan of putting the plug (aka "loose tenon") in the top of the mill for a number of reasons.

Mainly it's because the top is going to need (a) the 1/4" through hole for the drive shaft, (b) a 7/8" rebate to receive the drive shaft plate (the circular disk with the square hole in the middle), and (c) the 2 little screws that fix the drive shaft plate to the top.

(Also, if the tenon is part of the mill base, you can fill it all the way to the top with peppercorns, since nothing is going to press down into the cavity from above ... but that's a very minor point.)


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## Graybeard (Apr 14, 2013)

I'm afraid I don't understand exactly what your suggesting. Pictures would help if you have the time. We all learn from each other, that's the beauty of these boards.

Graybeard


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## DKMD (Apr 14, 2013)

duncsuss said:


> ...(Also, if the tenon is part of the mill base, you can fill it all the way to the top with peppercorns, since nothing is going to press down into the cavity from above ... but that's a very minor point.)



You lost me here, Duncan... If you're using the shafted mechanism, doesn't the plug prevent peppercorns from getting down to the mechanism? I guess depending on the diameter of the mill and the free tenon, you could drill through holes to allow movement of peppercorns from one side to the other. 

I'm not fully caffeinated yet, so I'm probably missing something obvious.:morning2:


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## duncsuss (Apr 14, 2013)

The top has a rebate (to receive the tenon), it has a 1/4" through hole and the drive shaft plate.

The bottom has a 1" diameter hole for the peppercorns to go in, and the tenon which mates with the recess in the top.

The objective is to replace the tenon with a piece of wood glued into a rebate drilled out to receive it. I called that piece of wood "a plug" -- but it will have to be drilled through so the mill can be filled with peppercorns.

[attachment=23139]


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## DKMD (Apr 14, 2013)

That's interesting, Duncan. I haven't ever done the top like that, but I can see some benefits to doing it your way. I've always done that mechanism like the CSUSA instructions with the drive plate screwed to the spigot/tenon:

[attachment=23140]


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## BarbS (Apr 14, 2013)

duncsuss said:


> The top has a rebate (to receive the tenon), it has a 1/4" through hole and the drive shaft plate.
> The bottom has a 1" diameter hole for the peppercorns to go in, and the tenon which mates with the recess in the top.
> The objective is to replace the tenon with a piece of wood glued into a rebate drilled out to receive it. I called that piece of wood "a plug" -- but it will have to be drilled through so the mill can be filled with peppercorns.



Here's an alternative: buy an expandable jam chuck from PSI and insert it into the lower opening of your long-body piece, into a drill chuck in the head stock, then use that short tenon/mortise arrangement to jam fit the top piece to it at tail stock end, using a 60º revolving center at the top 1/4" hole, with extra room on the top knob piece to part off as designed. 
http://www.pennstateind.com/store/CJAM1.html

Addendum: This is how I just did my first 10" pepper mill, and that's what comes of not understanding the directions, discarding them, and figuring out a way to do it on your own. ;-)
PS - I'd also use a tight pressure-fit on that short tenon connecting the two, to turn with, then sand it a little so it turns freely when assembled.

Another PS- This also is a good way to not have to measure in numbers for the length of the mill... I found just turning to round, cutting an estimated length for the top, plus extra, and mounting the pieces this way, all I had to do was pencil mark the bottom location of the grind mechanism, then hold the steel shaft on top of the jam-fitted blanks and I could see the exact length I wanted it to be, top to bottom. It save a Bunch of angst!


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## duncsuss (Apr 14, 2013)

DKMD said:


> That's interesting, Duncan. I haven't ever done the top like that, but I can see some benefits to doing it your way. I've always done that mechanism like the CSUSA instructions with the drive plate screwed to the spigot/tenon:



Aha! Now I see why nobody could understand what I was trying to do!

I didn't invent this method -- just followed a very detailed guide that was written by Mike Hawkins (firehawkmph on woodworkingtalk.com) and ended up with a working peppermill :i_dunno:


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## duncsuss (Apr 14, 2013)

BarbS said:


> Here's an alternative: buy an expandable jam chuck from PSI and insert it into the lower opening of your long-body piece, into a drill chuck in the head stock, then use that short tenon/mortise arrangement to jam fit the top piece to it at tail stock end, using a 60º revolving center at the top 1/4" hole, with extra room on the top knob piece to part off as designed.
> http://www.pennstateind.com/store/CJAM1.html



Thanks Barb!

I've got a few methods to chuck the bottom of the mill body, so I don't need to buy (yet) another ... but you have reminded me, I have a set of "drum sander" thingummies to go in a drill press, they look just like this, and there are 5 or 6 different diameters. Another option for the future! 

I was planning to finish the shape of the outside more or less the way you describe -- with the two pieces jammed together and held tight by the tailstock. I think last time I pushed the 60 degree cone into the big opening, rather then the tiny hole on top. Or maybe I used a block of wood I shaped from some waste to avoid splitting it open if I squeezed too tight.


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## BarbS (Apr 14, 2013)

duncsuss said:


> BarbS said:
> 
> 
> > Here's an alternative: buy an expandable jam chuck from PSI and insert it into the lower opening of your long-body piece, into a drill chuck in the head stock, then use that short tenon/mortise arrangement to jam fit the top piece to it at tail stock end, using a 60º revolving center at the top 1/4" hole, with extra room on the top knob piece to part off as designed.
> ...



You're welcome, and I have to say, you're smarter than I am. When I ordered the $7 expandable rubber chuck, I received it and thought, "well, that looks just like my drill press drum sander thingummy." So now I have lots of 'em. 
And, no need to overtighten that tail stock; the 60º revolver holds it just fine with only a light pressure.


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## Graybeard (Apr 14, 2013)

One tip that Nick Cook shows in his demo is to drill a small opening just deep enough for the metal circle that drives the shaft in the tenon. Since they're punched out each is a little different so he uses a forstner bit that's smaller and opens the hole using a parting tool or a square scraper so the circle fits. It you do this after drill the 1/4 inch hole (he uses 5/16 in bit) the circle will center exactly in the tenon.

Graybeard


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## duncsuss (Apr 14, 2013)

Graybeard said:


> One tip that Nick Cook shows in his demo is to drill a small opening just deep enough for the metal circle that drives the shaft in the tenon. Since they're punched out each is a little different so he uses a forstner bit that's smaller and opens the hole using a parting tool or a square scraper so the circle fits. It you do this after drill the 1/4 inch hole (he uses 5/16 in bit) the circle will center exactly in the tenon.
> 
> Graybeard



It doesn't show in the pic I posted, but I recessed the plate into the top that same way.

I find I get best results when I drill the wide diameter hole first, the spike of the Forstner bit leaves a clear center point to start the 1/4" hole afterwards.


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