# My mill mandrel



## Nubsnstubs (Oct 21, 2018)

Below is a video I just made trying to explain a mandrel I made about 7 years ago when I was making a bunch of mills. It really did increase my accuracy to the point of being able to interchange my parts from other mills and have them work like they are suppose to. After making about 50 mills, I just stopped. Haven't made any since at least 2011. 

Anyone have any questions, please don't hesitate. .... Jerry (in Tucson)

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 2 | Useful 3


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## The100road (Oct 21, 2018)

Cool tool. 

So how much are you selling them for? ;)


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## Nubsnstubs (Oct 21, 2018)

I'm not. Someone asked how to be more accurate making mills. Since I have already experienced some issues and solved those issues, I just thought I'd would show the jig and give the sizes needed. Most of you can make this tool out of Mesquite, or other equivalent wood......... BUT, a rough guess for a price would be $500+ for the prototype, and after the first 500 copies are made and sold, the price could drop to $50-$75. 

The machine shop I use is in a friends welding shop who has a mill and lathe. The mill is used as a drill press when they need to drill holes. The lathe collects dust. I'm pretty much the only person, a cabinet/furniture maker btw, using both machines dealing with any kind of accuracy within .001". Anyone else comes in, rounds something, squares up a piece of metal, or drills a hole or two, and leaves. I set up the vise, and mill things, or use the lathe to make things like live centers, Chuck Plates, articulated arms, tool rests, steady rests and things needed for woodturning. When ever a customer needs anything that has to be machined, if I happen to be there, he pays me to do the work. He will not accept any type of payment I should owe him for using his equipment. Of course, if I break something, I am the one liable for repairs. 

If you could round up 5 people who would want one, I might be up for tackling it with his approval. Doing one at a time sucks. .............. Jerry (in Tucson)


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## kweinert (Oct 22, 2018)

Sorry to be dumb here, but when you say 'mesquite or equivalent' what do you consider equivalent? Chunks of mesquite aren't common in these parts although I could probably acquire some from around WB. 

I'm presuming you mean any hardwood that's dimensionally stable.

And I'll ask another, hopefully not so dumb, question. I don't need the 1/4" rod at the end at the moment (although I could see making one of these for that type of mill) but could you drill a hole in the end of the jig using the drill chuck and epoxy in an aluminum rod instead of turning it? Would that maintain the accuracy and eliminate the breaking issue you had?

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Nubsnstubs (Oct 22, 2018)

kweinert said:


> Sorry to be dumb here, but when you say 'mesquite or equivalent' what do you consider equivalent? Chunks of mesquite aren't common in these parts although I could probably acquire some from around WB.
> 
> *I'm presuming you mean any hardwood that's dimensionally stable.*
> 
> And I'll ask another, hopefully not so dumb, question. I don't need the 1/4" rod at the end at the moment (although I could see making one of these for that type of mill) but could you *drill a hole in the end of the jig using the drill chuck and epoxy in an aluminum rod instead of turning it*? Would that maintain the accuracy and eliminate the breaking issue you had?


Yes to both, Ken. I did that when I made the wood prototype, and then decided I wanted something that would be more permanent like solid aluminum. Having FREE use of metal working machines is a big plus for any of the brilliant ideas I come up with. My only cost is the metal I need to proceed, and the fuel it takes to drive to and from his shop. The only failure I've had so far is the Taper attachment I made for his lathe. I made it too long, and it would flex while cutting Morse Tapers. 

If you need Mesquite, I could send you some...... Jerry (in Tucson)


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## Karl_TN (Oct 22, 2018)

Jerry, Do you think customers weren't buying your mills because of disinterest in function (pepper mills now pass'e), in style (top hat form vs flowing female form), in wood (plain vs burl), in high price? Do you have any pics & prices of your mills right before you quit making them.

Thanks,
Karl


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## Nubsnstubs (Oct 23, 2018)

Karl_TN said:


> Jerry, Do you think customers weren't buying your mills because of disinterest in function (pepper mills now pass'e), in style (top hat form vs flowing female form), in wood (plain vs burl), in high price?* Do you have any pics *& prices of your mills right before you quit making them.
> 
> Thanks,
> Karl




Karl, I am not a very aggressive sales type person. I'm not lazy, but don't have a big drive to get my stuff noticed. I would rather be making something than pushing my stuff, like my Tail Stock Steady that in total probably cost me over $10,000 with all the R&D plus the patent. The wood stuff I make is just to stay busy doing something while retired. If it sells, good, if not, I was as happy as a pig in turds while turning it.......

Thanks for asking for a picture. Since I always long winded, below are a two pictures of 6 mills that have been stored since 2012?. Also, the color is more yellow than the pieces. Lighting or camera not set right...The two 12" Mesquites in the middle right are complete salt mills ready to go. The far right doesn't have a mechanism.

The three on the left are 10" Hickory without mechanisms. The wood is from Branson, Missouri. One not pictured when turned had what looked like an almost purrrfect arrowhead in the wood. Since I am a flintknapper and the person I got the wood from is also a flintknapper, I figured he wood really appreciate it, and he sure does. 









As far as price, I was asking $50 for the Mesquites, and the Hickory were never seen by anyone other than me, my wife, and now anyone who views them on WoodBarter.
I was trying to get a place called Canyon Ranch to sell them on consignment, but I believe they had a another supplier that supplied any type of woodworking to them that they just weren't interested in what I had. I am convinced that none of my mills were put in the showroom because everything in there that I looked at had a price tag with the sticky back. When I retrieved my mills 90 days later, there was no sign of ever having anything stuck to them. They were as clean as when I left them there.

I did see a way overpriced Mesquite bowl in the showroom that had a $675 price on it that wasn't worth 200 bucks retail. It was still there when I went back to get my mills........Jerry (in Tucson)

Reactions: EyeCandy! 1 | Informative 1


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## Nubsnstubs (Oct 25, 2018)

Karl_TN said:


> Jerry, _*Do you think customers weren't buying your mills because of*_* disinterest* in function (pepper mills now pass'e), in style (top hat form vs flowing female form), in wood (plain vs burl), in high price? Do you have any pics & prices of your mills right before you quit making them.
> 
> Thanks,
> Karl



Karl, I think you are right. Right here on this site that is a bunch woodturners and even they don't show an interest in pepper/salt mills. ................... Jerry (in Tucson)


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## kweinert (Oct 25, 2018)

OK, so I used a nice chunk of wood and created a NubsNStubs jig for my pepper mills.

There's a 1" diameter tenon on the end that's about an inch long. Behind that is a tenon that's about 3/8" inch deep by 38mm (1 1/2") diameter. This gives me the ability to turn both the one-handed mills and the T-handled mills (the inner diameter of the T-handle mills is 1 1/8" so the tenon for the smaller mills isn't an issue and I can get away with one jig for both mills.)

So the 1" tenon seems to be fine. I've not yet turned a mill on it but the one blank I have is a snug fit but can be twisted on and off.

I turned the first T-handle mill and it took me 20 minutes to get it off the tenon. So before I started the next one I touched it up just a little.

You all know where this is going, right? A little too much. 

The next mill it's the end of the tenon that bears on the blank, it moves a little too much, and I can't even turn it because it spins entirely too easy. *sigh*

Luckily I still have enough wood left on the jig to turn a new 38mm tenon and try again.

I do have a question though - I almost think that my lathe may not be running true. Even with the tight fitting tenon I can feel just a little bit of movement, especially when I'm sanding. I see two possibilities here - one is that my jig constructing performance is lacking (a likely candidate) and the second is that my lathe doesn't run true.

What's the easiest/best way to check that? And if it isn't running true is there a fix for that short of buying a new lathe?


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## Karl_TN (Oct 25, 2018)

Jerry, I was hoping there was still some interest since I recently bought 10 pepper/salt mill kits. My dyed fruit bowls get a lot more attention and sell better than my normal bowls. This has got me thinking about dying some mills to match the dyed fruit bowls in order to make a combination sell.

Ken, You can try testing alignment using two pointed centers, but sometimes the problem can be in the accessories. Look over this NOVA alignment device to see if it might help any:

NOVA Acruline 2MT Alignment Lathe Accessory

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Nubsnstubs (Oct 25, 2018)

Ken, I'm pretty sure you did the point to point test. Both can align and look even and still be a mile off. The 2 points coming together doesn't really tell you if the tailstock is misaligned in the ways. I hope I can explain this where even I can understand it. 

When your quill is drawn back into the tailstock, insert a live or even a dead center. Bring up the tailstock until you reach the headstock, which should also have something in it with a point. If the points match or align, pull the tailstock away. Extend the quill out as far as it will go, and then bring the tailstock back up to the headstock. Check for mismatch. If it doesn't match, then it's more than likely the tailstock tongues are misaligned in the ways. If the points align, great. You are almost done.

Pull the tailstock back away from the headstock, and if you had that tool that Karl just posted, insert it into the headstock. Bring the tailstock, and see if the live center point will align into the center holes in the end of that tool.

You really don't need that particular tool. Mount a 6" piece of wood into your chuck. Face it smooth while trying to leave a dimple in the absolute center. Bring up the tailstock to see if it aligns with the dimple that was just made. If it doesn't align, the tongues or the bolts at the headstock are causing the problem. If it does align, the culprit is the operator. ........... Jerry (in Tucson)

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Graybeard (Oct 25, 2018)

Great fix Jerry, definitely removed one variable. Ken, I feel your pain. I've made one out of wood but it moved like all wood. I watched a video on making mills and the fella put the pieces in a kiln after drilling them out so they might stabilize. When he took them out he could work with wood that was a little more stable. Anyone use one of these: https://www.rubberchucky.com/store/p18/Pepper/Salt_Mill_Chucky.html


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