# Teach me about the lathe



## F.W.von (Apr 7, 2016)

Theres some old school auction lathes up this week.
I'm liking the 6' powermatic because it seems best for all I want to do, and the reviews on PW 90's are good.

Theres a 4' PW 90
And there's a 4' Oliver 56k ?

I think the Oliver is the cutest of course, it's 220v, nice, but I don't know, that brand is potentially gonna be hard to upkeep since they sold off 20 years ago

Whatever, these are all mystery machines.
My question is this:
I want to turn bowls, big bowls, and I don't know lathes enough..... So do you put the bowl on the outside of the headstock with the (adjustable step clamp key thing) ?

I'd like the 6' lathe, guessing it takes the bowl on the left of the headstock


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## F.W.von (Apr 7, 2016)

"Chuck"
Can a chuck go on the outside of the headstock?

A friend told me that on a better lathe, the entire headstock slides all the way to the right side of the bed for doing bowls.... The Oliver lathe looks like it would slide over on its bed....


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## Kevin (Apr 7, 2016)

I would snatch up that Oliver. That's not advice though wait until some of the real turners weigh in. I'm just sweet on old Oliver equipment and it does look more versatile than the fixed head PM. 

@barry richardson @DKMD @Dennis Ford @steve bellinger @David Hill and others........

@Mike1950

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## barry richardson (Apr 7, 2016)

I'm not really up to speed on old lathes, but in general they were never really designed to turn big bowls and such, mainly spindle work. Most have 1" spindles, maybe smaller.... Don't see a motor on the Oliver, is it some sort of direct drive? A good chance these are 3 phase motors too. By the time you get a convertor, and other stuff to adapt it for big turning, you might be better off shopping for a modern lathe.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Steve Walker (Apr 7, 2016)

What is "big bowls"?

I believe all the lathes shown have a 12" swing, meaning, the biggest bowl they would turn in normal configuration is gonna be about 11 1/2 to maaaaybe 11 3/4.

Big thing on these old "school" lathes is, most all of them are 3 phase, so unless you have 3 phase power available to you, you're gonna need a phase converter or a vfd.

Without having reverse, turning outboard ain't happening. A vfd, would give you reverse, at added expense. 

Even if the Oliver headstock will slide( not for sure that it will), you're going to need an outboard tool rest as well.

Big bowls start out as BIG BLANKS, which sometimes need to be started out speed wise down around 200 rpms, sometimes even slower. Low end is faster than that by at least double, and you're in for a scary ride with a 150# out of balance wet blank spinning at 400+ rpms.

So, not to rain on your parade, but they aren't the best choice for "big bowls". That isn't to say that with some added expense and upgrades that they won't work. A vfd, and 2" risers on the headstock and tailstock, and you can get just under 16" bowls all day.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Informative 1


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## Schroedc (Apr 7, 2016)

Unless those particular lathes end up being really inexpensive (3-400 or less) by the time you look into a VFD, Outboard stand, Etc, you'll have more money invested that you'll probably want and probably won't be totally happy with the results for turning big bowls. Also if the headstock are 1x8 threads or something similar (The Oliver looks that way, can't tell on the PM) you'll be limited on how big a chuck or faceplate you'd feel comfortable mounting to it which limits your blank size. 

If you could give us some idea of what you consider a big bowl we could probably make a few suggestions. Oneway, Newer Powermatics, Nova, Jet, Grizzly, and others all make lathes with bigger swings for larger bowl turning and with some diligent research and patience can be had on Craigslist and other places for quite a bit less than new retail in pretty good condition and often include all the extras you'll need like tooling, chucks, faceplates, etc.

Reactions: Like 2


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## F.W.von (Apr 7, 2016)

This is good info from all, thank-you.
I'm guessing these lathes will go for 2-300 each.
The Oliver is 220v, but the powermatic a 3phase
(And the Oliver has the motor inside the headstock)
I think I'd like to build as big a bowl as I can, 3'….…why not, but"scary ride" is a good note.
Maybe the Oliver is the most moveable head stock, I searched the net trying to find details, but being a novice to the art, I'm vastly short on terminology.

I imagine that the Oliver headstock slides all the way to the end of the bed, but that's me rationalizing that old high school machine like it is, maybe wasn't moved as if turning a bowl is "scary" for scholastic liabilities
Last of all, I will be needing a 3 phase converter anyway to run the 10hp 24" planet I got hold of. Apparently anything of lower HP can run off one big converter. Outright, the rotary phase converter is 1500$, but I have a friend at Grainger who offered me his employee discount, so maybe I can get out for half price


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## Schroedc (Apr 7, 2016)

If you're going to turn a 3 foot bowl, That lathe probably isn't going to have enough power to do it or at least do it well and safely. You may be able to slide the headstock to the far end but looking at the way those old machines were wired you'll probably have to move the switch box and all the other electrics at the same time. For bowls that big you're probably going to want to look at machines like a Oneway 2436, Powermatic 4224 (Or at least a 3520) or similar machines. At least 2HP, 3 if you can get it. The largest piece I've turned on my Oneway 2436 was about 30 inches (Turning off the backside of the headstock) and unless you can get really slow speed when getting started you have the possibility of flipping the lathe right over due to the fact most pieces of stock won't balance right away.

For stuff that large I'd probably budget at least 3,000-5,000.00 for a lathe and tooling and start shopping around the country (the nice thing is most of them will be 220v/Single phase so you won't need a converter or they'll have the phase converter built in like the Oneway). This is just my opinion for safety and doing the job you want, other folks might have something else to say.

Reactions: Like 1


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## F.W.von (Apr 7, 2016)

It's be nice to go large on the 5k giant lathe, but I may need to hook up some bigger dollars first.
I'll likely have to work out my homemade lathe for the big stuff first.
Just for fun I plan on using the chainsaw blade on a grinder on an armature... But I'll get pics up if I survive my perversion of this manuever of American garage technology!


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## DKMD (Apr 7, 2016)

I'm not all that familiar with any of the older lathes you mentioned. The prices seem very reasonable if you're interested and willing to mess with risers and the electrical issues, but none of them were intended to do big faceplate work. Personally, I'd pass on all of them if my intent was to turn bowls that size.


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## David Hill (Apr 7, 2016)

Old iron is hard to resist. (Guess I got flagged because I did have an Oliver lathe in my progression of machines)
The lathes you're showing are more for spindle work and not bowls. The biggest bowl you _might _get on these is maybe ~ 8 inches and don't think that any of'em will go slow enough for unbalanced blanks.
The headstocks *don't move* on any of them, and outboard turning though possible will require building tool rest supports/outriggers= more money and time.
Save your money and get a lathe with enough throw and speed control to do what you want.
Not trying to rain on the parade, just being realistic. That and consider the source/age of the machines- great potential for needing new parts that are hard to come by.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## steve bellinger (Apr 7, 2016)

Well i guess i'll take a slightly different approach. If you can get one of these for the price you think. (200 300) Grab it and learn the basics as far as technique and control. Also you will want to learn to sharpen your gouges,so get some cheaper ones and learn what needs learning. After you have the confidence go ahead and get a nicer lathe. I'm more than sure you will get your money back from this one. Or just keep it and turn smaller stuff on it, like calls and " hair sticks" LOL I don't believe you are gonna find a new Minnie this cheap. Good luck man as your journey down this slippery slope progresses. :)

Reactions: Like 2 | Agree 1


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## Schroedc (Apr 7, 2016)

Steve is right, any of those would be decent spindle and small bowl lathes. Great to learn on but the reason I said what I did was that it sounded like you wanted to do big bowls right of the bat.

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## F.W.von (Apr 7, 2016)

I would like to snag one for fun. Spindles and small bowls are good.
Probably the easy invest if I can get that 6' for 200.

I'll entertain you all with my big bowl oddity project. Tee hee!

Reactions: Like 1


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## Fsyxxx (Apr 7, 2016)

My second lathe was an Oliver from 29. I turned a crap load of stuff on that thing before I got the big Vic. Love that machine. It's a great machine to learn on. Get a vfd worth it all day long. Just sold mine recently. If I had room I'd have kept it.

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## F.W.von (Apr 7, 2016)

I can get a phase converter for the Oliver for 80 buxksish, 
But what is a vfd?


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## Kevin (Apr 7, 2016)

Variable Frequency Drive. For your application it's better than a phase converter because it's that and did I mention variable speed and reverse?

Reactions: Agree 3


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## pinky (Apr 11, 2016)

Any of those lathes would be good for a first lathe if the price is right. It would let you see where you want to go with turning. Years ago I had a Yates American that I turned into a big bowl lathe with minimum money invested. Picked up a discarded commercial treadmill with a 2 hp DC motor. Bought the proper speed controller with reverse for it. I added a double pulley to the shaft and hung the motor below. Welded a steel table and bolted it to the lathe on the outboard side. The banjo was part of a spare bracket off an old Ford Bronco. Could turn up to 42". The lathe was $300 and controller at the time was around $200. Every thing else was laying around. Turned some big stuff but would have been better with a tailstock. Could be a project in your future.

http://i45.Rule #2/albums/f52/pinkygalini/lathe002_zpsba7eeacc.jpg

http://i45.Rule #2/albums/f52/pinkygalini/lathe003_zps06155099.jpg

Reactions: Like 5 | Way Cool 1


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## Kevin (Apr 11, 2016)

pinky said:


> Any of those lathes would be good for a first lathe if the price is right. It would let you see where you want to go with turning. Years ago I had a Yates American that I turned into a big bowl lathe with minimum money invested. Picked up a discarded commercial treadmill with a 2 hp DC motor. Bought the proper speed controller with reverse for it. I added a double pulley to the shaft and hung the motor below. Welded a steel table and bolted it to the lathe on the outboard side. The banjo was part of a spare bracket off an old Ford Bronco. Could turn up to 42". The lathe was $300 and controller at the time was around $200. Every thing else was laying around. Turned some big stuff but would have been better with a tailstock. Could be a project in your future.
> 
> http://i45.Rule #2/albums/f52/pinkygalini/lathe002_zpsba7eeacc.jpg
> 
> http://i45.Rule #2/albums/f52/pinkygalini/lathe003_zps06155099.jpg



That's quite industrious John.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## F.W.von (Apr 11, 2016)

Neat homemade big lathe!
Glad the Ford bronco came in handy off road. I like welding it all to the table too.

I was going for the 4' pm90, but I got caught in a dead spot for phone internet access. It went away for 300, and I wished I'd fought for it. Tough cuz I have too much stuff going on right now, so maybe it's best to get sorted out first.
I'm pretty creative, and maybe putting some of my junk together is keeping the faith.

I think learning about the vfd is wise, and I can probably build a big lathe easier than dropping 3k on one.
I have nice 2hp motor collecting dust, a friend discount at Grainger and some nice welding equipment.
N skills.

The 6' PW 90 sold for 2000!
That's crazy money, so close to a new machine I cant see the wise in that bidder.
I never bid on the Oliver, it was cute as all hell but I didn't trust it would be serviceable.
Anyway, I'll hit you all up for smarts again
I think hunting down a headstock and a chuck is my first priority. I have all sorts of steel and what for framing my big lathe.
Thanks again for lessons, elswise ID have had a sad feeling for what turned out to be a pass.


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## Dennis Ford (Apr 13, 2016)

If you plan to build a lathe, it would be better to buy a small lathe and use it for a while. Then you will know more about what features are important to you and you will have some understanding about safety issues that will become very important on a bigger machine. I have some experience with home made machines and will offer advise but it will not likely help much if you have not used a wood lathe before. I will say that home made makes sense for a big lathe but not for smaller ones and that a blank big enough to make a 30" bowl will make a 1000 lb lathe dance around the shop.


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## F.W.von (Apr 14, 2016)

I have an old home made pottery wheel that some weirdo like myself built from heavy duty junk.
I should be able to make some disks from ply wood to attatch to blanks and then secure to the pottery wheel top.

Once I can rotate a blank at all, I will likely weld up really big c clamp that I can pin into top dead center of my blank.

My plan continues with clamping a 4.5 " grinder to an as adjustable armature and running chainsaw carving blades on the grinder to approach the blank, 

I should be able to kick the pottery wheel around until I've cut the blank down into balance before turning on the motor at all. Also, the variable electric motor can compliment the mechanical speed control on the old pottery wheelyrig.

It should be noted that I'd like to use power tools to carve and sand.
I'm not disrepecting the way of the turner's chisel, I just don't have no chisels yet.
But I do have grinders, motors, air drills and lots of router bits. Got a welder, plasma cutter and so much more crapola to toss into the beasty.
If your imagi ation can't make sense of it....later on a few pics might

Reactions: Like 1


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