# Attention wiring/electrical/lighting gurus!



## waterboy12 (Aug 1, 2013)

I have my lights (2 separate runs) on a dedicated 20A breaker running through 2 light switches that turn the lights on and off. I hung and wired in 2 ceiling fans this afternoon and tied into the wiring for the lights. I got everything wired and working fine, however the reason I tied into the wiring for the lights was because I thought if I did that I could control the ceiling fans with the switches for the lights. However the fans stay on regardless of weather the lights are on or off. What should I be looking for, so I can tie into the right wires. If this doesn't make sense I'll try to explain a little more. I thought it would be simple....but apparently it wasn't that simple.


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## NYWoodturner (Aug 1, 2013)

waterboy12 said:


> I have my lights (2 separate runs) on a dedicated 20A breaker running through 2 light switches that turn the lights on and off. I hung and wired in 2 ceiling fans this afternoon and tied into the wiring for the lights. I got everything wired and working fine, however the reason I tied into the wiring for the lights was because I thought if I did that I could control the ceiling fans with the switches for the lights. However the fans stay on regardless of weather the lights are on or off. What should I be looking for, so I can tie into the right wires. If this doesn't make sense I'll try to explain a little more. I thought it would be simple....but apparently it wasn't that simple.



:rotflmao3: Josh - WE might be related  I'll just sit here and wait with ya for a response. This sounds like a mistake I have made often. 
Scott


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## woodtickgreg (Aug 1, 2013)

waterboy12 said:


> I have my lights (2 separate runs) on a dedicated 20A breaker running through 2 light switches that turn the lights on and off. I hung and wired in 2 ceiling fans this afternoon and tied into the wiring for the lights. I got everything wired and working fine, however the reason I tied into the wiring for the lights was because I thought if I did that I could control the ceiling fans with the switches for the lights. However the fans stay on regardless of weather the lights are on or off. What should I be looking for, so I can tie into the right wires. If this doesn't make sense I'll try to explain a little more. I thought it would be simple....but apparently it wasn't that simple.


It sounds like the wires that you tied into are not switched, they have power all the time. Invest in a circuit tester, they are cheap, under 10 bucks. They have 2 wires that you can touch to wires and see if they are live, the tester will light up and even tell you what voltage the live wire is. Check the switches and see if the black wire is the switched wire, it should be as the black is the live or line wire, white is return to complete the circuit. 
Next question, do both switches control all the lights? If they do they are 3 way switches and that's a whole other topic.
Some pics of the switches would help.


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## waterboy12 (Aug 1, 2013)

Ok each switch controls a separate run of lights. Each run is 3 lights and has its on switch. Flip the switch the lights go on. Turn it off the lights go off. I tied my neutral for the fans into the neutrals that were already there, my power for my fans wired to a white and black wire that were already wire nutted together(120v confirmed by my meter). There is also a stray blue wire running through my junction box. I looked at a few diagrams on the net and saw that a blue wire was being used to send power from the switch to the lights. Could this blue wire be my missing link?


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## Dennis Ford (Aug 1, 2013)

If the blue wire is carrying power from the switch to the lights, that is the one you should wire the fans to.
Do NOT believe that a wiring diagram on the internet, in a book or magazine can help you decide what color wire was used. Trusting this type of information can get you hurt, killed or burn your house down. You need to verify each wire to see if it is hot, switched, neutral or ground. Color codes do exist but don't bet your life that they were followed.


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## woodtickgreg (Aug 1, 2013)

waterboy12 said:


> Ok each switch controls a separate run of lights. Each run is 3 lights and has its on switch. Flip the switch the lights go on. Turn it off the lights go off. I tied my neutral for the fans into the neutrals that were already there, my power for my fans wired to a white and black wire that were already wire nutted together(120v confirmed by my meter). There is also a stray blue wire running through my junction box. I looked at a few diagrams on the net and saw that a blue wire was being used to send power from the switch to the lights. Could this blue wire be my missing link?


Is the white and black wire a white wire that has the end colored black? that is called recoding, marking a white wire black tells someone that that wire is recoded to carry current or be a live line wire. Without seeing how each switch is wired at each box I can only guess what the blue wire is. What does the blue wire connect to?


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## waterboy12 (Aug 1, 2013)

Dennis Ford said:


> If the blue wire is carrying power from the switch to the lights, that is the one you should wire the fans to.
> Do NOT believe that a wiring diagram on the internet, in a book or magazine can help you decide what color wire was used. Trusting this type of information can get you hurt, killed or burn your house down. You need to verify each wire to see if it is hot, switched, neutral or ground. Color codes do exist but don't bet your life that they were followed.



Yea sir I agree completely. I have wired many ceiling fans to switches but I was doing all the wiring and new exactly what everything was. I've never done it in the manner I am trying to do now. The only reason I say it's my blue wire is its the only one that's not accounted for. I have my neutrals, I have my black and white(power) I have to whites running through the box(returns) and then I have that blue wire. I'm thinking its the switch wire. I will try my clamp meter tomorrow and see if I can get a voltage reading off that blue wire.


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## woodtickgreg (Aug 1, 2013)

Dennis Ford said:


> If the blue wire is carrying power from the switch to the lights, that is the one you should wire the fans to.
> Do NOT believe that a wiring diagram on the internet, in a book or magazine can help you decide what color wire was used. Trusting this type of information can get you hurt, killed or burn your house down. You need to verify each wire to see if it is hot, switched, neutral or ground. Color codes do exist but don't bet your life that they were followed.


+1, that is why I suggested the tester as well. What does the blue wire connect to? at both ends? I gotta go to bed, 4 am comes early.


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## waterboy12 (Aug 1, 2013)

woodtickgreg said:


> Is the white and black wire a white wire that has the end colored black? that is called recoding, marking a white wire black tells someone that that wire is recoded to carry current or be a live line wire. Without seeing how each switch is wired at each box I can only guess what the blue wire is. What does the blue wire connect to?



I'm not sure if the white wire was recoded. I didn't notice if it was. Like I said, before I ever wired my fans in I had neutrals, the black and white(120v). 2 whites that run through the box(I'm guessing returns for the lights) and then I have that stray blue wire that is throwing me for a loop. I tied my neutrals for the fans into the neutrals in the box, my power for the fans into the black and white(120v) and my ground wire to the ground in the box. That's as simple as I can explain it with out drawing a picture and you surely don't want me drawing a picture.


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## waterboy12 (Aug 1, 2013)

Ok so I went back out to the shop and I think I've got. I opened up the box for the switches and found my blue wire(120v when lights are on)It's coming off both switches and going up towards my lights. I also found my black and white wire that is recoded in the switch box. 
http://i572.Rule #2/albums/ss169/nasty01cummims/null_zpsf8a9c4a1.jpg

I also took a picture of the box I was tiring in my fans to. You can see all the neutrals together, the black and white and the blue wire that is looped around inside the box and goes out the other side. A quick question though. If I have 120v when the switches are on and zeroV when the switch is on that is my switchable power correct? 
http://i572.Rule #2/albums/ss169/nasty01cummims/null_zpscc20d939.jpg


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## waterboy12 (Aug 1, 2013)

Just double checked. 120v on the blue when the switch is on. ZeroV when the switch is off. I think I found my switch wire


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## Brink (Aug 2, 2013)

I see a BX cable without an insulating "redhead", white wires connected to black wires and there's a known switching problem.

My only advice would be to have an electrician come in and straighten this out. The $ saved as a DIY project just isn't worth the risk of shock or fire.


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## woodtickgreg (Aug 2, 2013)

I do not understand why they use that blue wire, that would normally be something they would do with a 3 way switch. And as I suspected a white wire has been recoded as black to carry power.


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## waterboy12 (Aug 2, 2013)

Got it all finished up this morning. Thanks for all the help


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## waterboy12 (Aug 2, 2013)

waterboy12 said:


> Got it all finished up this morning. Thanks for all the help



Blue wire was switch wire. Spliced in my power wire for the fans and she's good to go.


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