# Wooden Katana



## Kevin

Let's try out the new phone to see how the camera works. My all-wood knife will be the traditional Japanese Samurai Warrior's soul mate - the Katana. The blade is going to be of Beeswing Narra. I haven't chosen the woods for the handle, guard, collar, and other numerous parts of a katana but I have most of them narrowed down. I will also most likely be using cord in the project and I will learn how to properly wrap a sageo if I do it. Not yet sure if I will use cord on the handle but I might.










Well as we can see the phone sucks eggs. But for $79 whattya expect.

Reactions: Like 1 | Way Cool 8


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## Don Ratcliff

This is how you upgrade your phone...

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 13


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## ripjack13




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## rocky1

This is gonna be cool!

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Schroedc

Well, I guess I'll scrap the Wakizashi. 

I need to get farther along and post pictures, I slice my blade material and Marc uses that stuff. I decide on something and Kevin does it. I have one other idea in mind as I want something unlike what anyone else is doing.

This will be way cool. Can't wait to see how it turns out!!!

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kevin

Don't scrap it they are two differrnt tools used bh tbe same master. It would be cool to see oir i terpretatios. You the taller guy making tbe shkrt sword and me the shkrt guy making tbe long sword. 

God i hatr thjs effing ohone you get the idesa.

Reactions: Funny 6


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## ripjack13

My brain hurts reading that....

Reactions: Agree 2 | Funny 1


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## Don Ratcliff

ripjack13 said:


> My brain hurts reading that....


Don't push the Lil guy to hard. This phone might push him over the edge. We need him to supply the FBE, unless there is someone else that can?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Kevin

Back on the computer finally WOW I am sapped trying to learn that alien device. One thing is for certain THE CAMERA SUXXXXXX. Anyway I made some progress. This will be the last I have a chance to work on it for a while. 



 

Scribes were a mix of freehand and square . . .



 




 




 



 

Cutting a curved blank so attention must be paid to keeping the cutting point flat on the table where it meets the blade or fingers (and blades) can get compromised....


 

Mucho grande handwork will be needed on this. If I was a monkey it would only take me a few months to complete. Since I'm not, it's only going to take me a few months to complete . . . 



 

More roughing the tang. I wanted a full length tang but this is the blank I wanted for the blade, and a full length tang was not possible even for my shorter-than-average height. 
Katana length's varied according to the height of the Samurai. He had to be able to draw his sword quickly and with ease - the blade that allowed him that 
was what the sword smith would make, yet still have the longest blade possible. It was just another subtle nuance of sword making . . . . . 


 

Curved tang - had to do it on the rough but we will fix it in the next step . . . . 



 

Making the tang straight and square (in the rough) so no ugly glue lines are seen with x-ray vision . . . 


 



 

Like I said LOTS of handwork to do on this. Almost all of it will be including hand sanding. It will test my patience more than a sucky ass android phone . . . 



 


The half-tang is actually thicker than what the blade will be - there's a transition that must occur.


 

The edge grind I'll be shooting for is this . . . 



 

But we'll see about that. I'll just be happy to finish it even close to that. Here's some other species I am compiling to use . . . 



 


This is going to be fun if I don't pull my hair out or my weenie off.

Reactions: Way Cool 5


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## Don Ratcliff

I was reading along, looking at the shitty pictures thinking, this is a cool build. BOOM! I'm accosted with the visual of you Yankee the wankee till the Lil nub breaks off.

There goes sleeping for a while. How do I get that nasty image out of my brain?

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## Kevin

Don Ratcliff said:


> I was reading along, looking at the shitty pictures thinking, this is a cool build. BOOM! I'm accosted with the visual of you Yankee the wamkee till the Lil nub breaks off.
> 
> There goes sleeping for a while. How do I get that nasty image out of my brain?



You gonna pull that Katana or whistle Dixie?

Reactions: Like 1 | Great Post 2


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## Molokai

Subscribed


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## Don Ratcliff

Me too

Reactions: Like 1


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## MKTacop




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## Schroedc

Don Ratcliff said:


> There goes sleeping for a while. How do I get that nasty image out of my brain?



Gouge it out with a fork.

Reactions: Agree 3 | Funny 2 | Useful 1


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## Tony

Looking good, ready to see more! Tony


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

wow oh wow....looking like a great build....my one question...you the guy on the right or the guy one the left?


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## Kevin

Jack "Pappy" Lewis said:


> wow oh wow....looking like a great build....my one question...you the guy on the right or the guy one the left? View attachment 110446



Those are ninjas, the Samurai's arch enemy . . . .


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## DKMD

So you're saying short guys have smaller swords, huh? I don't know that spreading that info is helping many of us on this site. Besides, it's not the length of the sword but the samurai who's swinging it... Said every short samurai in history.

Reactions: Agree 2 | Great Post 1 | Funny 3


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## MKTacop

DKMD said:


> So you're saying short guys have smaller swords, huh? I don't know that spreading that info is helping many of us on this site. Besides, it's not the length of the sword but the samurai who's swinging it... Said every short samurai in history.



Sounds like someone may have some "insecurities".....

Reactions: Agree 2


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## ripjack13

Schroedc said:


> Gouge it out with a fork.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## Foot Patrol

Kevin the blade looks good. Looking forward to seeing the finished sword.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

LOL...leave it up to the old man to not know the difference between a Samurai and a Ninja...


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## SENC

Its been long enough now.

Take the protective plastic film off of the camera lens. Should help with picture quality.

Reactions: Great Post 1 | Funny 5


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## norman vandyke

Are there any woods that look like the traditional eel skin for the grip? Perhaps some dremel work?


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## ripjack13

Lacewood?


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## Kevin

norman vandyke said:


> Are there any woods that look like the traditional eel skin for the grip? Perhaps some dremel work?



I'm not going for exact traditional look - just want it to look cool when done. In fact the choice of beeswing narra for the blade wasn't a good one if I wanted to try to get in the ballpark of color and pattern of material. I appreciate the suggestion though it is a good idea to keep in mind.

Reactions: Like 1


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## norman vandyke

Kevin said:


> I'm not going for exact traditional look - just want it to look cool when done. In fact the choice of beeswing narra for the blade wasn't a good one if I wanted to try to get in the ballpark of color and pattern of material. I appreciate the suggestion though it is a good idea to keep in mind.


I'm sure it will end up looking awesome!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Don Ratcliff

If all you were going for was cool looking you nailed that a few pics ago.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin

norman vandyke said:


> I'm sure it will end up looking awesome!



That's yet to be determined . . .

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## Don Ratcliff

Ooo Ooooo I know this one...

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 4


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

Choices choices choices....LOL whatever it ends up being it is gonna be a killer!


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## ripjack13




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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


>



Don't hurry me I've been trying to tie my shoelaces . . . sheesh!

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 3


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## robert flynt

That right there is some purtty wood!


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## robert flynt

norman vandyke said:


> Are there any woods that look like the traditional eel skin for the grip? Perhaps some dremel work?


Cross cut black palm might look like ray skin.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## SENC

Kevin said:


> That's yet to be determined . . .
> 
> View attachment 110558


A fork, take it!

Reactions: +Karma 1


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> A fork, take it!



I Berra not try to take both at the same time ....


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## SENC

Both forks? No, I wouldn't, either (or "too", as @Tony would say).

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Tony

SENC said:


> Both forks? No, I wouldn't, either (or "too", as @Tony would say).





Sorry I aren't as edumecated as you you Henry!

Reactions: Funny 1


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## SENC

Tony said:


> Sorry I aren't as edumecated as you you Henry!


Sorry. Can't pick on MS Tony any more so it fell to you. Or, you could send me something nicer than he did and then you'd be my new best buddy and I could pick on @Tclem again.

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Tony

SENC said:


> Sorry. Can't pick on MS Tony any more so it fell to you. Or, you could send me something nicer than he did and then you'd be my new best buddy and I could pick on @Tclem again.



I can do that, I've got gooder lookin' pine than he does, I'll send you a bunch if it! Tony

Reactions: Funny 3 | Sincere 1


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## Don Ratcliff

SENC said:


> Sorry. Can't pick on MS Tony any more so it fell to you. Or, you could send me something nicer than he did and then you'd be my new best buddy and I could pick on @Tclem again.





Tony said:


> I can do that, I've got gooder lookin' pine than he does, I'll send you a bunch if it! Tony

Reactions: Funny 4


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## Don Ratcliff

@Kevin
Careful when picking a direction...

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> Both forks? No, I wouldn't, either (or "too", as @Tony would say).



His dad wouldn't want to too.



Tony said:


> Sorry I aren't as edumecated as you you Henry!



It's edum*a*cated! Dang Tony you making us Texians looking more worser.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 3 | Way Cool 1


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## Tony

Kevin said:


> It's edum*a*cated! Dang Tony you making us Texians looking more worser.



Maybe that's how y'all North Texans spell it, but down here A's are in short supply.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 3


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## Kevin

I got about 2 hours in on it. I haven't named it yet because I haven't gotten the tamashii of the project yet (I had to look that up). I've always named things that are important to me, or not at all important to me, or anything in between. I haven't named it yet. _It_ yet again by explanation, meaning I don't know what sex it is even yet but I get the feeling it's a male sword . . . . .

The blade warped on me so I had to place some weight on it for 3 days. It's just about perfectly straight again but I don't know if it'll want to go back to being crooked . . . 



 

I wanted to use a holly handle (tsuka) but the only piece of holly I had long enough is a 14" pepper mill blank which I'm not willing to sacrifice for a toy sword, so I grabbed this piece of unknown - I believe it's sycamore . . . 


 

After a lot of hand sanding the handle began to take shape......



 

Oh I did taper the tang before fitting it to the handle . . . 


 



 

Started working on the guard (tsuba). I intially made a snakewood guard out of primo stuff, but it just didn't look right so I went with ringed gidgee . . . 


 

That off center tenon is going to accept the collar (fuchi) which I have yet to decide on a species - maybe more ringed gidgee. I'm also going to incorporate some kind of attempt at a menuki (ornamental design on the butt of the handle) so that should probably be riged gidgee to balance the color of the handle. But of course the handle will be mostly invisible once wrapped, which is why I didn't opt for a highly figured piece of wood for it. This is my last day of crappy pictures hopefully I'll get into town and pick up a new phone today. 

I don't have the handle and blade lined up properly here, and I have not finished sharpening it yet (I cut myself with it already) but you get an idea of the blade thickness . . .

Reactions: Like 4 | EyeCandy! 1 | Great Post 1 | Way Cool 1


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## Kevin

Oh by the way it was raining last night when I was working on it . . .

Reactions: Like 1 | Way Cool 2


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## deltatango

The photo of the Katana in the sky is awesome Kevin - very cool.
Wonder what style Tsuba you're going to do?
I imagine it won't be square to avoid confusion with the urban legend of Ninjato.


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> The photo of the Katana in the sky is awesome Kevin - very cool.
> Wonder what style Tsuba you're going to do?
> I imagine it won't be square to avoid confusion with the urban legend of Ninjato.




I'm not familiar with Ninjato. I was going to cut a captive star into the tsuba and have the blade come through that star but the curl in the gidgee begs to be left alone. I think I'll cut a captive star in a practice piece and see what I think.


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## Kevin



Reactions: EyeCandy! 1


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## deltatango

Being wood, I imagine too delicate and it might break easily.
Here's a nice simple design that would be strong (hope I'm not meddling):







From the Late Edo period around 1850. Shakudo fukurin (outer rim) could be ebony, etc.
I think it's cool you're doing a Katana.

Reactions: Way Cool 1


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## Kevin

not meddling at all. I been looking at designs for days. gonna ay with the star tonite or tomorrow. having a new problem now will post a thread about it later


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## Kevin

think I'll go get a phone first tired of these crappy pics...

Reactions: Like 1


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## Blueglass

The warping of the blade is one of the reasons I came up with the lamination idea. I knew as thin as I wanted to get it that there was that chance. Coming along very nicely.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kevin

I don't think I will make the deadline. I worked on it again today for the first time since I last posted, but the Tsuba has given me so much hell today I am discouraged. Back-orders be damned I used 4 hours of my life to try and get it like I want and I am not even close. I'm using hand techniques not cheats, so it is very discouraging thus far. I'm going to give it the old college try again right now though. My wife says I'm being too anal just because I lived in Japan and that I can hide my mistakes. Well, yeah. I am being anal because I don't hide mistakes I redo them trying to mimic a Japanese craftsman. I expect perfection from myself but don't have the skill they do. Let's see what happens anyway - I haven't given up yet .......

Reactions: Like 1 | Sincere 2


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## Schroedc

Kevin said:


> I don't think I will make the deadline. I worked on it again today for the first time since I last posted, but the Tsuba has given me so much hell today I am discouraged. Back-orders be damned I used 4 hours of my life to try and get it like I want and I am not even close. I'm using hand techniques not cheats, so it is very discouraging thus far. I'm going to give it the old college try again right now though. My wife says I'm being too anal just because I lived in Japan and that I can hide my mistakes. Well, yeah. I am being anal because I don't hide mistakes I redo them trying to mimic a Japanese craftsman. I expect perfection from myself but don't have the skill they do. Let's see what happens anyway - I haven't given up yet .......



Your not the only one worrying about deadline, I've been so busy with everything else at the shop that the parts have sat on my desk and mocked me every day.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ripjack13



Reactions: Agree 1


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## SENC

Kevin said:


> My wife says I'm being too anal


Are you sure she wasn't just saying you're an ass?

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> Are you sure she wasn't just saying you're an ass?



Probably.


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## deltatango

Fast means going slowly without interruption. - Japanese proverb. 改善 Kaizen

Reactions: Like 2


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## Schroedc

deltatango said:


> Fast means going slowly without interruption. - Japanese proverb. 改善 Kaizen



I thought the proverb was "man who stand on toilet high on pot"...

Reactions: Funny 4


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## deltatango

Kevin said:


> I don't think I will make the deadline. I worked on it again today for the first time since I last posted, but the Tsuba has given me so much hell today I am discouraged. I'm using hand techniques not cheats, so it is very discouraging thus far.



I'm not sure I know what cheats are anymore, now, after well over 45 years at it. At one point in my life I had a very clear vision and understanding of what that kind of thinking was about until when in Paris I saw one of Michaelangelo's "Prisoners" (the purposely unfinished works that depicted bond slaves). I was marveling at how incredible the craftsmanship was throughout the piece, when around the back, where the figure would have been separated from the block, I saw a curving, sweeping line that was made from very small drill holes equally spaced that defined an area that presumably would have been cut away. I was shocked that this"cheat" was employed - a technique that went counter to my expectations of sculpting a certain way. I thought about that for a long time and came to understand about David Pye's idea of the craftsmanship of certainty vs the craftsmanship of risk. The holes were drilled for the sake of certainty, for the ability to surely and carefully attain a particular difficult line without risking the sculpture and potentially cracking or breaking an area that might have had problems with how the form was working with the grain. It was then I understood that his artistry was anchored by incredible craftsmanship or choice and necessity. 

Sometimes the right path in doing something is simply the one which just takes one to the destination. Take the expected path and it sometimes becomes easy to get lost in the woods. Craftsmanship has as its basis after all, the essential aspect of invention, which fosters innovation. The mark of a true craftsman is the one who can make good his mistakes. The mark of the master is the one who foresees the mistake and invents the tool to avoid it.

Reactions: Great Post 3 | Sincere 1


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## Wildthings

Schroedc said:


> Your not the only one worrying about deadline, I've been so busy with everything else at the shop that the parts have sat on my desk and mocked me every day.


Me too with moving into a new house, I can't find half, hell more than half, of my things! LOL


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

hey all.......you know that nothing is written in stone here about this calendar thing.....I know we had originally went with the 15th deadline, but we also talked about having 12 months and then 15 and then front and back and 6 more months...so...LOL...who cares about a deadline? It is gonna be a 2017 calendar anyhow....

Reactions: Like 2


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## ripjack13

Jack "Pappy" Lewis said:


> hey all.......you know that nothing is written in stone here about this calendar thing.....I know we had originally went with the 15th deadline, but we also talked about having 12 months and then 15 and then front and back and 6 more months...so...LOL...who cares about a deadline? It is gonna be a 2017 calendar anyhow....



Have you looked into how long it takes to have them made?


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## Kevin

Now I understand why Habaki is crucial . . . . that's my next step.





You can see how I screwed up my 2 attempts to carve the Tsuba according to the blade, and that's what I was being anal about. Third time was the charm. I might pull this off yet.

Reactions: Like 2 | Way Cool 1


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## ripjack13

Habaki, I had to look that up.
I'm loving this build Kevin. While I am pleased with my knife, I think it would have been very cool to make one of these. I like a challenge, and I see this as a good one. And Kudos to you.


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## Tony

Hey, even if you never get it done, you're braver than me. I didn't have the sack to try it.


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> I'm not sure I know what cheats are anymore, now, after well over 45 years at it. At one point in my life I had a very clear vision and understanding of what that kind of thinking was about until when in Paris I saw one of Michaelangelo's "Prisoners" (the purposely unfinished works that depicted bond slaves). I was marveling at how incredible the craftsmanship was throughout the piece, when around the back, where the figure would have been separated from the block, I saw a curving, sweeping line that was made from very small drill holes equally spaced that defined an area that presumably would have been cut away. I was shocked that this"cheat" was employed - a technique that went counter to my expectations of sculpting a certain way. I thought about that for a long time and came to understand about David Pye's idea of the craftsmanship of certainty vs the craftsmanship of risk. The holes were drilled for the sake of certainty, for the ability to surely and carefully attain a particular difficult line without risking the sculpture and potentially cracking or breaking an area that might have had problems with how the form was working with the grain. It was then I understood that his artistry was anchored by incredible craftsmanship or choice and necessity.
> 
> Sometimes the right path in doing something is simply the one which just takes one to the destination. Take the expected path and it sometimes becomes easy to get lost in the woods. Craftsmanship has as its basis after all, the essential aspect of invention, which fosters innovation. The mark of a true craftsman is the one who can make good his mistakes. The mark of the master is the one who foresees the mistake and invents the tool to avoid it.



Although I'm no master, I have preached that very philosophy right here more than once. But I seem to be able to preach easier than I practice. Thanks for the reminder. 




Jack "Pappy" Lewis said:


> hey all.......you know that nothing is written in stone here about this calendar thing.....I know we had originally went with the 15th deadline, but we also talked about having 12 months and then 15 and then front and back and 6 more months...so...LOL...who cares about a deadline? It is gonna be a 2017 calendar anyhow....



No deadlines will change for me. Mine will be submitted on time ready or not.

Reactions: Like 1


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## SENC

Well, now that you're approaching completion, I might as well ask. Does a sword even qualify for a knife calendar?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ripjack13




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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

I haven't ye will do that today


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> Well, now that you're approaching completion, I might as well ask. Does a sword even qualify for a knife calendar?


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

is it wooden? Does it have a sharp edge? is length an issue? Not with me..... I tried to contact Vista through chat but got a dummy...going to call them after I hear from Teknatool this morning, hopefully, they claim I am first on the list today...LOL

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

Jack "Pappy" Lewis said:


> contact Vista through chat but got a dummy


Yea, that always is the case. they just are there to make a sale not answer questions. even though they say they are....calling and talking to them direct is best.


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## Kevin

I won't have time to get the saya made or the tsuka wrapped, but scabbards weren't required and not all Samurai preferred a wrapped tsuka. Also wanted to make a fancier tsuba with a ying-yang carved into it just don't have time. The tsuba is 2-tone hormingo with a nice dark line separating the colors. First coat of tru oil on it. Try to get some good pics by tomorrow gotta finish shredding a pasture before the rains come in . . . .

Reactions: Like 1 | EyeCandy! 1 | Way Cool 8


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## Tony

That's a fine looking sword Kevin! Tony

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


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## robert flynt

That is is really good looking Katana, Kevin. I really love it!!

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

Kevin with your Katana we will have the 12 pics for the Calendar....

Reactions: Like 1


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## NYWoodturner

Thats bad ass Kevin. Now you need to replicate in in steel!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin

Jack "Pappy" Lewis said:


> Kevin with your Katana we will have the 12 pics for the Calendar....



Thanks Jack, but I dont think I can get calender-worthy pics in time for you in time. When do you need them by?


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## Jack "Pappy" Lewis

we are still in the process of gathering so you have time

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Strider

I go away for a while and all of you guys go crazy, making wooden katanas n shitake! :pp

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Kevin

Strider said:


> I go away for a while and all of you guys go crazy, making wooden katanas n shitake! :pp



I'm on my 3rd attempt trying to wrap the tsuba with the ito. Anyone thinks this is easy guess again. Looks easy. AIN'T!!!

Reactions: Way Cool 1


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## Tony

Kevin said:


> I'm on my 3rd attempt trying to wrap the tsuba with the ito. Anyone thinks this is easy guess again. Looks easy. AIN'T!!!



C'mon Kevin, that's like falling off a log man!

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kevin

Tony said:


> C'mon Kevin, that's like falling off a log man!



I thought it would be too but try it - it's very hard to do and make it look like a pro did it. It's easy to do if you don't care how crappy it looks.


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## Tony

Kevin said:


> I thought it would be too but try it - it's very hard to do and make it look like a pro did it. It's easy to do if you don't care how crappy it looks.



Just watch that video, that guy probably has his eyes closed! I'm sure it is easy to do....... the 4000th time! Tony

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Strider

Looking at it seems easy, yes.
So do the wet hickory logs, cut down, seem easy to split. Broke my back and made the maul cry. Or was it me? Not sure. Better use a landmine and roll the log on top of it.

If I were you, I would get a nice piece of white oak, steambend it because of the grain and strength, start planing the back and buy a wooden bokken because I failed miserably and cried some more.


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## Kevin

I'm gonna go with this attempt but it's so far from good a Japanese master would beat me with a bamboo staff and force me to climb an icy rock mountain on my knees.









Now after a few more wraps all I gotta do is learn how to tie the end knot without a slot at the butt, because I elected not to use one and confine the end knot to within just the ito itself. I now think it was a bad decision.

Reactions: Like 1 | EyeCandy! 2 | Way Cool 2


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## rocky1

No climbing icy rock mountains on your knees until the knee is healed! 

Looking good Kevin! Regardless of what Japanese masters might think.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 2


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## Tony

Looks pretty dam good to me, but I'm not a Japanese master......

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


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## ripjack13

That is looking better and better each time Kevin. Nicely done....

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## deltatango

I think you deserve the "Pit Bull Award" for sticking with this the way you have Kevin.
I admire your dogged determination.
What you are making is not an easy thing to do.

よくできました
Yoku dekimashita

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> よくできました



どうもありがとうございました

I finished the tsukamaki - it turned out okay for the first time. I thought my broke finger was healed up but doing this made it feel broken again pretty quick - I honestly had to do most of this wrap without the use of my right index finger. That made it doubly difficult. 

I'm going with a very basic sageo - probably just a safety knot. I made a very unconventional elongated kurigata so no fancy butterfly knots forthcoming. Hopefully I can get the stand built tomorrow and finish everything up and be done and take final pictures no later than Friday. After that I'm gonna box it up and send it to its new owner.

Reactions: Way Cool 2 | Sincere 1


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## robert flynt

Kevin said:


> I'm gonna go with this attempt but it's so far from good a Japanese master would beat me with a bamboo staff and force me to climb an icy rock mountain on my knees.
> 
> View attachment 114532
> 
> View attachment 114533
> 
> Now after a few more wraps all I gotta do is learn how to tie the end knot without a slot at the butt, because I elected not to use one and confine the end knot to within just the ito itself. I now think it was a bad decision.


Do it like the fishing rod builders do and you want have a knot at all.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin

robert flynt said:


> Do it like the fishing rod builders do and you want have a knot at all.



I've departed from traditional katana making a little but I wasn't willing to completely abandon tradition and not have the knot at all - I completed the knot and it is close enough for a Texan . . . the handle wrap (tsukamaki) is complete.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

これは素晴らしい出ています


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## deltatango



Reactions: Like 1


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## SENC

虎穴に入らずんば虎子を得ず


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


>



I've seen his videos. When I was trying to learn how the sageo is used I watched this one.


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## Kevin

I think that's a different guy. They all look the same to me.

Reactions: Funny 2


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## deltatango

ripjack13 said:


> これ





SENC said:


> 虎穴に入らずんば虎子を得ず


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## deltatango

Kevin said:


> I think that's a different guy. They all look the same to me.



You didn't just say that!!!!

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> You didn't just say that!!!!



Just a joke - most of the members here know I love the Japanese people and their culture. Lived there 3 years and hope to return one day.


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## ripjack13

SENC said:


> 虎穴に入らずんば虎子を得ず



私は虎を探しています誰が言いましたか？


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


>



They can't use Google Translate for that.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## deltatango

Of course, Kevin, I was joking too. I'm hooked on arts of Japan, the people and the culture.
Even though it is not today what it was in previous periods.

How was it that you came to live there for three years?


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> Of course, Kevin, I was joking too. I'm hooked on arts of Japan, the people and the culture.
> Even though it is not today what it was in previous periods.
> 
> How was it that you came to live there for three years?



I was a Navy brat. We were stationed in Atsugi 1968 through 1970 - some of my most formative years 9 through 11 years of age. My sister and I soaked up the language like a sponge at that age. But it's not like riding a bike - you don't use it you forget it. But the memories I will never forget. Thanks to the internet we got into contact with some of our Japanese friends 3 years ago and have remained in touch. They're planing to come here and us there.


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## ripjack13

deltatango said:


>



One of em is "big" still working on the others.
Brb...


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## deltatango

That's awesome. An excellent upbringing.

Very cool to reconnect with childhood friends.

I can see why you treasure that time there.


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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


> One of em is "big" still working on the others.
> Brb...



Just a hint it has something to do with @deltatango


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## ripjack13

Corrction....it's wood.


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## ripjack13

Kevin said:


> Just a hint it has something to do with @deltatango



I know....(inside info)


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## Kevin



Reactions: Like 1


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## deltatango




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## deltatango

Another hint:

Hanji, Kanji
Kanji, Hanji

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kevin

Hanji?


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## DKMD

Cool looking sword! I don't know anything about traditional Japanese swords, so any deviations you made are not obvious to me.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## deltatango

http://grandricci.org/paraitre_sceaux_leaflet.pdf


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## deltatango

Kevin said:


> Hanji?



Japanese Kanji are derived from Chinese characters sometimes referred to as Hanji (Hanzi).

Seal Script mostly dates back to archaic Hanji (Hanzi) Han being the operative word.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_characters

Differences between Kanji and Hanjzi:

https://eastasiastudent.net/regional/hanzi-and-kanji/

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## DKMD



Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## ripjack13

Kevin said:


>



I need to do this on my pc in the morning. My tablet keeps crashing. Too many images...lol

But I'm really trying....

Reactions: Sincere 2


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## ripjack13

bottom right character...precious.


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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


> bottom right character...precious.

Reactions: Agree 1 | Funny 1


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## SENC

ripjack13 said:


> 私は虎を探しています誰が言いましたか？


 

私じゃない

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

私はたくさん持っています


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## SENC

ripjack13 said:


> 私は虎を探しています誰が言いましたか？


Mine is a japanese idiom, not to be translated directly, but as you found it translates directly to "if you do not enter the tiger's den, you cannot catch the cub". Roughly equivalent to "no pain, no gain; nothing ventured, nothing gained; or you can't have success without hardship/struggle/suffering". That just seemed fitting with all of @Kevin's whining about his hurt finger.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> That just seemed fitting with all of @Kevin's whining about his hurt finger.



私の指を非難しないでください


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## SENC

Kevin said:


> 私の指を非難しないでください


凸(｀0´)凸
This finger?

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> 凸(｀0´)凸
> This finger?



ಠ益ಠ)

Reactions: Funny 1


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## SENC

Kevin said:


> ಠ益ಠ)


You are my googling equal! Maybe even superior!


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> You are my ... superior!



Bout damn time you admitted the self-denials. You must be seeing a shrink finally . . . . . . .

Reactions: Funny 3


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## SENC

Kevin said:


> You must be seeing a shrink finally . . .


Funny, coming from someone already shrunk!

Reactions: Great Post 1 | Funny 3


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## ripjack13

ripjack13 said:


> bottom right character...precious.



It took me 3 hours to find that one character....was I right?


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> Funny, coming from someone already shrunk!



A clip from when I was in hospital . . . .

Reactions: Great Post 1 | Funny 4


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## SENC

ripjack13 said:


> It took me 3 hours to find that one character....was I right?


I thought you were just commenting that the bottom right character was precious.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## SENC

ripjack13 said:


> It took me 3 hours to find that one character....was I right?



expensive */* noble */* precious */* (honorific) your

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

SENC said:


> expensive */* noble */* precious */* (honorific) your



So...I got it correct?


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## Kevin

SENC said:


> expensive */* noble */* precious */* (honorific) your



I don't think that's correct. But I can't find any references for "Hanji", what Mark says is a Samurai adaptation of Kanji. @deltatango a little help.....we can't figure out this mysterious Hanji language.


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## SENC

ripjack13 said:


> So...I got it correct?


It seems so to me.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

Kevin said:


> I don't think that's correct. But I can't find any references for "Hanji", what Mark says is a Samurai adaptation of Kanji. @deltatango a little help.....we can't figure out this mysterious Hanji language.



I downloaded a pdf called 
Complete list of Chinese simplified characters∗ 
Denis Roegel 15 September 2008

It has a huge amount of characters. 

I haven't given up...but I'm running out of time for looking tomorrow. 
Lot's of stuff to do...but I'd be interested in what he says it is...


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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


> I downloaded a pdf called
> Complete list of Chinese simplified characters∗



Maybe Mark meant Hanzi which is Chinese not Hanji. Kanji is Japanese writing which is derived from Chinese, so some characters are nearly identical but have vastly different meanings usually. The only character that looks Chinese to me is the upper right one, but it could be Japanese also. Before we try to figure out what those characters mean - we have to know which language it is being written in!

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

Kevin said:


> Maybe Mark meant Hanzi which is Chinese not Hanji. Kanji is Japanese writing which is derived from Chinese, so some characters are nearly identical but have vastly different meanings usually. The only character that looks Chinese to me is the upper right one, but it could be Japanese also. Before we try to figure out what those characters mean - we have to know which language it is being written in!



The bottom two I found in the pdf. So I'm guessing chinese. But I could be wrong...


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## SENC

I think the left 2 are beautiful/beauty and wood/tree.


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## Kevin

Here's some typical examples of Hanzi and Kanji saying "My hovercraft is full of eels"....

Chinese Hanzi: 我的氣墊船滿是鱔魚。

Japanese Kanji: 私のホバークラフトは鰻でいっぱいです

We haven't even mentioned the other Japanese writing systems. Hirigana is used mostly for native Japanese words. Katakana is used mostly for foreign words. Again saying "My hovercraft is full of eels".

Japanese Katakana: マイ・ハヴァークラフト・イズ・フル・アヴ・イールズ

Japanese Hirigana: まい・はゔぁーくらふと・いず・ふる・あゔ・いーるず

Japanese Romaji (writing Japanese using Latin script): mai havaakurafuto izu furu avu iiruzu

It's complicated and I don't pretend to know much about it.


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## SENC

Kevin said:


> we have to know which language it is being written in!


I think the 

Hanji Kanji
Kanji Hanji

hint means

Chinese Japanese
Japanese Chinese


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## ripjack13

Kevin said:


> Maybe Mark meant Hanzi which is Chinese not Hanji. Kanji is Japanese writing which is derived from Chinese, so some characters are nearly identical but have vastly different meanings usually. The only character that looks Chinese to me is the upper right one, but it could be Japanese also. Before we try to figure out what those characters mean - we have to know which language it is being written in!


I'm pretty sure it's chinese, because of the link/hint he posted for the pdf...



deltatango said:


> http://grandricci.org/paraitre_sceaux_leaflet.pdf

Reactions: Informative 1


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## deltatango

OK, weighing in. First, it's very complicated. The arrangement of pictographs in archaic forms transitioning from chinese archaic seals to modern Japanese is almost impossible.
See this article about Hanji: http://sealang.net/sala/archives/pdf4/kess1997psycholinguistic.pdf

Marc, you are close, but not there, and likely you can not get there by literal translation.
pictograms work in concert to create overal statements, the way a haiku does in poetry.

Signature seals are yet more complicated in some cases when traditional forms are employed.
Somewhat like using an archaic form of language such as thee and thou, or wouldst thou, etc.

As I stated earlier, Japanese Kanji are derived from Chinese Hanzi. Hanji is a way Hanzi was spelled frequently in scholarly presentations, and today would only be recognized as archaic.

If you want to know the meaning of the seal, take it to an old Chinese man and ask him to read it, and translate it.
No doubt he will become wistful, and with a far off gaze, give you a prosaic answer. Show it to 10 people and you will get 10 answers. Most scholars will get it however.

Oddly, you are close in one way, yet far from the mark in another.

My seal was created by a master carver/seal maker in China by a collector of my work, as a gift.

Mystery solved. Go back to turning.


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## ripjack13

SENC said:


> I think the
> 
> Hanji Kanji
> Kanji Hanji
> 
> hint means
> 
> Chinese Japanese
> Japanese Chinese



I think so too..japanese characters came from chinese characters ...


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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


> I'm pretty sure it's chinese, because of the link/hint he posted for the pdf...



Ah so! I never saw that link.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> Mystery solved. Go back to turning.



NO sir, the mystery is not solved. What the heck is the translation?

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 2


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## SENC

So I see beauty/beautiful,cherish/admire,wood/tree, and noble/precious.

Perhaps as a seal it is a way of saying something like woodcrafter who honors the beauty in the wood?

Reactions: Like 1 | Informative 1


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## deltatango

Read article 4 time then discuss Daniel-san.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## ripjack13

Looks like I'm having chinese food for lunch tomorrow.....


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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


> Looks like I'm having chinese food for lunch tomorrow.....



I'm going to borrow my neighbors hovercraft and eat some eel.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> Read article 4 time then discuss Daniel-san.



No I'm gonna watch a movie with the wife and let Marc figure it for me.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## deltatango

When you see a road sign, which is logographic you don't need to think about it, it just means a certain thing which is understood. A curved arrow means a curve in the road. Simple. When you see 4 signs, such as stop, railroad crossing, caution, must stop for railroad tracks, a specific image is immediately formed in the mind.
There is no need to think it, it is a tacit communication of images.
If you don't know what each sign means, you can't know what the whole story or picture is.
Go to Belgium or Luxembourg, or Germany, get on the autobahn, and with no familiarity of the language or any knowledge of the signs, driving will be difficult. It is the same for understanding such iconographs.

Reactions: Like 1


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## ripjack13

Kevin said:


> No I'm gonna watch a movie with the wife and let Marc figure it for me.



Maybe I'll just keep it to myself.....neener neener neereeeer.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## Kevin

ripjack13 said:


> Maybe I'll just keep it to myself.....neener neener neereeeer.



Fine. Two can play this game. I'll just knock a zero off your next paycheck.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## ripjack13

deltatango said:


> When you see a road sign, which is logographic you don't need to think about it, it just means a certain thing which is understood. A curved arrow means a curve in the road. Simple. When you see 4 signs, such as stop, railroad crossing, caution, must stop for railroad tracks, a specific image is immediately formed in the mind.
> There is no need to think it, it is a tacit communication of images.
> If you don't know what each sign means, you can't know what the whole story or picture is.
> Go to Belgium or Luxembourg, or Germany, get on the autobahn, and with no familiarity of the language or any knowledge of the signs, driving will be difficult. It is the same for understanding such iconographs.




Ok...i get it. But I think Kevin would like to know what it means to you. You can tell him privately, cuz i like hunting down things. And I really want to find out on my own....

Reactions: Sincere 1


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## deltatango

So you want me to say, hmmm, that sign with the X in it means RailRoad Crossing?

Much more complicated than that. It's a different language from a different culture.

Some things just don't translate literally.

I have a gist of what it means to me explained by a scholarly individual.

All I could do is butcher it.

Once someone had an ancient man read it and he said:

"King of Wood is Expensive"

I laughed my ___ off.

Reactions: Way Cool 1


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## deltatango

Try something much more simple:

Ma Ke Mu Yi

See if you can find equivalents in logograms then translations.

Not sure if this will get you there, but if you match the words to the Hanzi (chinese)
It may put you on the right path. Remember, Chinese and Japanese Caligraphy are often interchangeable and thus can easily be confused. Sometimes they are combinations of the two.

I've tried to put that in as simple terms as I can.

So far Senc has been closest. On the right track.

Reactions: Like 1


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## deltatango

Kevin has the translation now.

Reactions: Like 1


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## deltatango

View attachment 114603

This was the first use of the seal when I got it from China as a gift.
They have to be used and broken in to make a perfect stamp.

http://www.sealsociety.org/more/glossary.html

Reactions: Way Cool 2


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## Kevin

I finally took some pics of the sword in better light. I took it to the Sam Rayburn Library today because I was going to photograph the sword on the marble rostrum from where Lincoln and other presidents addressed congress for so many years, and from where FDR gave his immortal _A date which will live in infamy _speech - I thought it would be cool to have pictures of a Japanese katana replica on that rostrum. I still may yet get them before I send it to its owner. I think it would be a cool backstory. BUT the danged thing was closed. I forgot it closes at 2 PM on Saturdays. So I took some pictures out front. Here's a few pics....

Reactions: EyeCandy! 1 | Way Cool 6


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## Tony

Kevin said:


> I finally took some pics of the sword in better light. I took it to the Sam Rayburn Library today because I was going to photograph the sword on the marble rostrum from where Lincoln and other presidents addressed congress for so many years, and from where FDR gave his immortal _A date which will live in infamy _speech - I thought it would be cool to have pictures of a Japanese katana replica on that rostrum. I still may yet get them before I send it to its owner. I think it would be a cool backstory. BUT the danged thing was closed. I forgot it closes at 2 PM on Saturdays. So I took some pictures out front. Here's a few pics....
> 
> View attachment 114703
> 
> View attachment 114704
> 
> 
> View attachment 114708
> 
> 
> View attachment 114706
> 
> View attachment 114710
> 
> View attachment 114711



That is dam impressive Kevin, you need to be very proud of your work on this one! Tony

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


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## Strider

Gorgeous!!

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Blueglass

Haven't hadmuch computer time. That came out sweet.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## NYWoodturner

After looking and looking I really understand why you put as much thought and emphasis on the wrap as you did. It truly contributes as much to the first impression as anything.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## Kevin

Sunday I started on the stand and last night I knocked it out. I just sprayed the first coat when I got back from logging a while ago. The HRB slab is supposed to represent a snow-capped Mt. Fuji - albeit one with much steeper slopes than what Fuji actually has but it was a function of the best slab I could find to mimic a snow-capped mountain. For infill it's got turquoise, atlantisite (spelling?) and some other stuff that I don't know what it was, I just crushed it up in my crusher and jambed it in the voids. The stand arms turned out looking sort of like antler tines according to my wife, but it was a happy accident because I was just cutting forms that looked good to my eye - no plans or templates. Lots of hand sanding!



 



 



 


The bottom detail curvatures will be a stretch for y'all non-Trekkies probably, but I tried to pay homage to a Klingon Bird of Prey with that outline. 



 

Needs a few more coats of poly.

Reactions: Like 1 | EyeCandy! 2 | Way Cool 4


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## deltatango

Thats pretty cool Kevin. I'd recognize Snow-capped Mt. Fuji anywhere. Very cool you found that slab - it works!

I was thinking, and now being presumptuous by saying, that the stand arms would be so cool if done with black lacquer as in traditional stands, Perhaps a dark wash alternatively? If the arms are darkened they will allow the rest of the work to stand out.

Very cool - it's great to see this whole project evolving.

Reactions: Agree 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> Thats pretty cool Kevin. I'd recognize Snow-capped Mt. Fuji anywhere. Very cool you found that slab - it works!
> 
> I was thinking, and now being presumptuous by saying, that the stand arms would be so cool if done with black lacquer as in traditional stands, Perhaps a dark wash alternatively? If the arms are darkened they will allow the rest of the work to stand out.
> 
> Very cool - it's great to see this whole project evolving.



I agree and was actually going to use some really dark ziricote that I have, but my hand skills are so rusty I was afraid to try. I think you're 100% right it would look much better if I sprayed the arms black. Can I apply lacquer right over the poly (oil based minwax rattle can) or do I need to lay down a coat of shellac between them?


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## Kevin

Mark look how close the natural edge top is to the actual mountain silhouette . . . .





I had that view for 3 years growing up as a kid, every time I stepped out my back door and started across the vast rice patties with that majestic mountain looming on the horizon. Damn those were heady days growing up there! We don't know what we got until it's gone do we.

Reactions: Way Cool 3


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## deltatango

Ooooo, I would probably put a sealer that is compatible with the poly after steel woofing it or resanding to establish some key for the sealer to bond to. You could try some aniline dye and see what happens, first, and build up layers. It could take on a beautiful patina with the grain showing through. Actually, Charle's video on laying down a stain prior to finishing now comes to mind. Might be worth revisiting?


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> Ooooo, I would probably put a sealer that is compatible with the poly after steel woofing it or resanding to establish some key for the sealer to bond to. You could try some aniline dye and see what happens, first, and build up layers. It could take on a beautiful patina with the grain showing through. Actually, Charle's video on laying down a stain prior to finishing now comes to mind. Might be worth revisiting?



I don't want to sand it back down to the wood. I'll just leave it as is before I do that.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## deltatango

Kevin said:


> Mark look how close the natural edge top is to the actual mountain silhouette . . . .
> 
> View attachment 115301
> 
> I had that view for 3 years growing up as a kid, every time I stepped out my back door and started across the vast rice patties with that majestic mountain looming on the horizon. Damn those were heady days growing up there! We don't know what we got until it's gone do we.



I noticed that right away Kevin. I've never been there but I have painted it many times.
You were really fortunate to have been there during formative years. It no doubt has had a tremendous effect on your aesthetic outlook. The slab just perfectly mimics it. Looks almost like something Hiroshige might have done. Very cool.

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## deltatango

I wasn't advocating sanding it all the way down, just enough for whatever to go on top.
Black lacquer works really well, then steel woolled with wax afterwards. Very easy, very effective.

EDIT:

If your poly is good and dry - it should take a rattle-can black. Just to be on the safe side, spray some over a test piece - doesn't have to be much - use a hair dryer to dry.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> I wasn't advocating sanding it all the way down, just enough for whatever to go on top.
> Black lacquer works really well, then steel woolled with wax afterwards. Very easy, very effective.



Mark I trust your finishing experience and knowledge as much as anyone's including Neil's and more than almost everyone's (I have studied your past work more than you know - I spent several hours digging up old articles and projects about you and your dad online), but I am going to ask him to weigh in as well just because he and I go pretty far back - here's the thread.

Reactions: Like 1 | Agree 1


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## deltatango

As long as I've dug this hole, I may as well dig deeper.

Flat black, several coats. Steel wool it really good, so that it is a very matte flat black, like charcoal.
Then begin putting paste wax - bowling alley type is fine, building the the coats, and when buffing buff lightly, but not bringing it to a high shine. I think you might be surprised what a great look it is.

Reactions: Informative 1


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## deltatango

I wouldn't have it any other way Kevin. That's why I brought up Charles. He's really the expert here.
My suggestion is about an overall look. How you get there, is your dilema.
Perhaps Charles will have a great take on it.

Reactions: +Karma 1


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## Kevin

Mark the reason I want to avoid doing it is because I'm in such a time crunch. And look at where Fuji meets the arms - that's a really hard place to sand. If I had 11 irons in the fire no problem but I have 12.  

I'm not looking for an easy way out, just don't want to get started on a 3 or 4 hour reboot - or 8 hours lol.

Reactions: EyeCandy! 1


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## deltatango

That's what you said about working on the Tsuba, right? LOL!!
Man, you've come so far with this thing, when you wern't even sure you were going to finish it at one point.
I'm encouraging you to take a deep breath, relax and just go where your instinct, your gut tells you.

You can do the rattle can and wax finish easily and fast too.

I think you owe it to yourself to relax and chill on this and see where it takes you.

Screw the other irons, LOL/

Reactions: Like 1 | Great Post 1 | +Karma 1


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## Kevin

deltatango said:


> That's what you said about working on the Tsuba, right? LOL!!
> Man, you've come so far with this thing, when you wern't even sure you were going to finish it at one point.
> I'm encouraging you to take a deep breath, relax and just go where your instinct, your gut tells you.
> 
> You can do the rattle can and wax finish easily and fast too.



See, I need your calming influence brother you just proved it again lol. You're right. I have about another short half hour to run the mill across another log - that will allow me to take a deep breath.

Reactions: Like 1


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## rocky1

Absolutely beautiful Kevin! While the lines may not be quite perfect, the first thought I had upon seeing it was Mt. Fuji. Amazing work all around on this project.

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


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## Tony

Okay, here's my 2¢. It looks really great now. You nailed the Mt. Fuji piece, that is spectacular. The arms are a great shape and would be fine just as they are. If what you wanted was to paint them booby pink with Day-glo green stripes that's what you should do. 
HOWEVER, if you want it dark, you should do that. I fully understand being super busy and wanting to wrap this up, but you owe it to yourself to complete it fully the way you want. Put in a little more time and finish it to your satisfaction. Whatever you should end up doing, be proud of your work brother! Tony

Reactions: Like 1 | Thank You! 1


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## ripjack13

Kevin, this is really coming out amazing looking. I'm sure the recipient of it will be most humbled by such a work of art....

Reactions: Thank You! 1 | Agree 1


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## Don Ratcliff

That's awesome Kevin! All around 5 stars sir...

Reactions: Thank You! 1


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## deltatango

OK Kevin, I've found your huckleberry.

http://www.minwax.com/how-to-finish-wood/change-stain-color-with-polyshades/

Here are the polyshades:

See Classic Black:

http://www.minwax.com/wood-products/stains-color-guide/

Should be a no-brainer!

Reactions: Way Cool 1


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## ripjack13

deltatango said:


>





Kevin said:


> They can't use Google Translate for that.





ripjack13 said:


> I need to do this on my pc in the morning. My tablet keeps crashing. Too many images...lol
> 
> But I'm really trying....





ripjack13 said:


> bottom right character...precious.





ripjack13 said:


> It took me 3 hours to find that one character....was I right?





SENC said:


> expensive */* noble */* precious */* (honorific) your





Kevin said:


> I don't think that's correct. But I can't find any references for "Hanji", what Mark says is a Samurai adaptation of Kanji. @deltatango a little help.....we can't figure out this mysterious Hanji language.





ripjack13 said:


> I downloaded a pdf called
> Complete list of Chinese simplified characters∗
> Denis Roegel 15 September 2008
> 
> It has a huge amount of characters.
> 
> I haven't given up...but I'm running out of time for looking tomorrow.
> Lot's of stuff to do...but I'd be interested in what he says it is...





SENC said:


> I think the left 2 are beautiful/beauty and wood/tree.





deltatango said:


> OK, weighing in. First, it's very complicated. The arrangement of pictographs in archaic forms transitioning from chinese archaic seals to modern Japanese is almost impossible.
> See this article about Hanji: http://sealang.net/sala/archives/pdf4/kess1997psycholinguistic.pdf
> 
> Marc, you are close, but not there, and likely you can not get there by literal translation.
> pictograms work in concert to create overal statements, the way a haiku does in poetry.
> 
> Signature seals are yet more complicated in some cases when traditional forms are employed.
> Somewhat like using an archaic form of language such as thee and thou, or wouldst thou, etc.
> 
> As I stated earlier, Japanese Kanji are derived from Chinese Hanzi. Hanji is a way Hanzi was spelled frequently in scholarly presentations, and today would only be recognized as archaic.
> 
> If you want to know the meaning of the seal, take it to an old Chinese man and ask him to read it, and translate it.
> No doubt he will become wistful, and with a far off gaze, give you a prosaic answer. Show it to 10 people and you will get 10 answers. Most scholars will get it however.
> 
> Oddly, you are close in one way, yet far from the mark in another.
> 
> My seal was created by a master carver/seal maker in China by a collector of my work, as a gift.
> 
> Mystery solved. Go back to turning.





Kevin said:


> NO sir, the mystery is not solved. What the heck is the translation?





SENC said:


> So I see beauty/beautiful,cherish/admire,wood/tree, and noble/precious.
> 
> Perhaps as a seal it is a way of saying something like woodcrafter who honors the beauty in the wood?





Kevin said:


> No I'm gonna watch a movie with the wife and let Marc figure it for me.



I found a few people over the months, to ask about the icon. The majority say it's , 
Beautiful wood.
expensive wood.

One guy said ..
Beautiful wood
King of wood.

Ok...I'm done. And I didn't give up......

Reactions: Like 1 | Way Cool 1 | Sincere 1


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## deltatango

ripjack13 said:


> I found a few people over the months, to ask about the icon. The majority say it's ,
> Beautiful wood.
> expensive wood.
> 
> One guy said ..
> Beautiful wood
> King of wood.
> 
> Ok...I'm done. And I didn't give up......



What the majority say is not always right, even though the majority think they are right.

What one guy says is often right even though he's not certain he is right.

The distinction between the two translations is seemingly small yet significantly vastly different.

Could it only be what one guy says, but which the majority mostly agree?

Oddly, only seal carver scholars know for sure, and they are a cantankerous lot.

Is it "King of wood" like "Kingwood", or King of Wood", as in "Elvis just left the building?"

Consider the source, consider the subject, make best guess Daniel San.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tony

deltatango said:


> What the majority say is not always right, even though the majority think they are right.
> 
> What one guy says is often right even though he's not certain he is right.
> 
> The distinction between the two translations is seemingly small yet significantly vastly different.
> 
> Could it only be what one guy says, but which the majority mostly agree?
> 
> Oddly, only seal carver scholars know for sure, and they are a cantankerous lot.
> 
> Is it "King of wood" like "Kingwood", or King of Wood", as in "Elvis just left the building?"
> 
> Consider the source, consider the subject, make best guess Daniel San.



Good to see you back on Mark! Tony


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## Don Ratcliff

Tony said:


> Good to see you back on Mark! Tony


Ok Marc Jr, here is your class in what is facebook and what is WB. On FB you sign your stuff "Tony" because your wife doesn't trust you to have your own account. On WB we know it is you and not Nikki because in this forum she let you try on the big boy pants. Please look at this picture and you might start to understand the level of effort on your part that is focused in proving you have on those above mentioned pants.





We get it, you are Tony! You are like a bad 80's band that "has done it again."

Reactions: Funny 6


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## ripjack13

I think he has it set on his phone to have a signature. You know...in case he forgets who he is....

Reactions: Agree 2


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## Lou Currier

You had to go there

Reactions: Funny 1


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